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OracleOfJita
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Posted - 2011.01.27 19:41:00 -
[1]
Ok, let's assume I have unlimited POS resources provided by the corp, it's not free, but for simplicity let's say it is. Let's also say I have all skills at level V, and can purchase as many facilities, BPOs, and materials as I need.
Counting only the on-going costs of buying raw materials in Jita, and assuming transport is free, how much can I expect to make, roughly, doing full PI/invention/manufacturing on my char?
I realize there's a lot of variables here, but I just want a rough range of how well the science/industrial side of EVE pays. |
Greg Huff
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:03:00 -
[2]
42
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Zircalla
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:08:00 -
[3]
Manufacturing can vary wildly, I won't even make a stab at it.
For PI, I run 4 P1 producing planets and 2 processing planets with my main. It is in a wh, so it does not translate exactly to hi-sec, but I make nothing but robotics (as well as some excess csmr elec. and mech parts) atm, and it comes out to about 7 mil/hr in sales, at least. The initial cost and customs taxes are minimal. I pretty much have to 'tend' the processing worlds daily (import/export from/to customs office), but the P1 worlds only every couple of days. There is a bit of running p1 to the processing worlds and moving heads, but I spend well under an hour a day - and make approximately 168 million per day. I am seeing depletion start to make a dent, so not sure I can keep going full-bore at the processing worlds. Will keep an eye on it an may diversify a bit to coolant or something.
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heheheh
Phoenix Club
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:16:00 -
[4]
There is no real answer to that, it all depends on exactly what you do, plus if there was a good answer, people wouldnt tell you anyway as they would not want you on there patch so to speak im afraid.
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Ezzia
Minmatar Dark Reality Unified
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:10:00 -
[5]
Theoretically the math of manufacturing as a moneymaker is very high. For example - if you have a character with 10 available slots (11 is max), and you can make 500k ISK per hour running that slot, and you can run that slot 12 hours a day, using all your slots you get the following result :
0.5 x 10 x 12= 60m per day. 60m x 30 days = 1.8 billion per month.
I intentionally used a low figure and a low daily hour amount. The truth of the matter is that minerals are the great barrier. When you find things that have *excellent* ISK per slot-hour the massive overabundance of minerals that you need in order to do so makes the logistics quite a chore. Input capitol is also a deterrent to making excellent ISK doing manufacturing. Not everyone has the ISK to start up.
PI is now very easy to run, and it makes a nice supplementary income if you have the stomach for it. You will see *vastly* varying figures presented by various people but its very easy to get approximately 150-300M per month.
Going back to manufacture for a moment, you'll be managing buy orders for minerals, managing sell orders for your production, hauling minerals and end products, and consistently updating jobs. It is not an easy profession or for the faint of heart.
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Ash Ar
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:16:00 -
[6]
Robotics and other POS fuels seem to be fairly efficient PI isk producers at the moment but it can and will change as people make more of it. Even if I said Robotics was the best thing to make now, that information might be too late. The 168 isk per hour seems a bit high to me since I like to include all costs : moving heads, shuttling P1 and P2 ingredients to other planets as needed, hauling to your favorite market hub and setting up buy/sell orders to try to maximize profits and then having to tweak those market orders.
when coolant was 20k isk per unit, I was making about 200 million per day with two characters and about 2 hours per day of work after it was all said and done. Now coolant and other pos fuels are around 8 to 11 k isk per unit so is not that lucrative as it was. Also, just like ore, figure out your isk per m3 and isk per hour. Robotics are high price per unit but how much isk can you jam into a hauler vs other lower level PI materials as well as how much profit you can make just selling the ingredients vs converting to the product. Often there is no difference or you can lose money converting upwards. Finally, all PI materials get extracted at the same rate but some are worth more than others. Sometimes it is better to extract one material and buy the other material and extract more of the profitable material. And I am not too worried about giving away any secrets here since, what I am explaining takes effort and thinking to execute. And there is always the possibility you tool up for something and then find a few days later the market screws your efforts and you are left with creating new factories and having to route (and forget to route) stuff from one unit to another.
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Zircalla
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:37:00 -
[7]
But for the real geeks, you have a spreadsheet that shows the 'equivalent' P1 value of all P2 goods, and the equivalent P1 and P2 value of all P3 goods. Robotics is still worth more than the P1 and P2 goods required as input. There IS some moving required, but the net result is that the isk/m3 for a unit of robotics is less than the isk/m3 for all the materials required to build it. The negative is also the lost extraction - the more advanced processors you use per account, the fewer extractors/heads you can put on the ground. This is the real potential drawback to higher end PI.
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Rathroku Aleock
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Posted - 2011.01.27 22:59:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Zircalla approximately 168 million per day.
It's impossible to make anywhere near 168 mil a day off robotics with 6 planets. Your talking out your ass.
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Ilena Grace
Power and Friendship and Heroism
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Posted - 2011.01.28 00:17:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Ilena Grace on 28/01/2011 00:16:59 Dear Zircalla,
If you are making 160m/day producing robotics as your product without importing from any other character I think you are getting your numbers wrong.
At current market pricing of 60K ISK per unit of robotics you need 36 or so advanced industries cranking out robotics non stop. Using an elite CC you'd need two planets dedicated to advanced factories.
160 mil / day. robotics cost 60K 160.000.000 / 60.000 = 4.000 robotics a day 4.000 / [24 hours in a day] = 160 / hour 160 / [5 Robotics per factory] = [32 advanced factories] making robotics [32 * 4 factories producing the P2 input product] = 128 advanced factories making the P2 128 basic industries making the P1 --- MegaWat requirements: 32*700 + 128*700 + 128*800 + 8*8100 = 279.2K in megaWatts. Elite CC generate 19K mW. 19K times 6 (for one character) -> 115K mW.
Required/Generated MW 279.2K mW 115.0K mW Missing 163.8 mW (CPU not considdered, it is not a bottleneck fitting requirement for Sub-P4)
4 Extractors per planet to extract the raw material, Producing 19.2K of P0 per extractor head or 192K raw material per extractor per hour.
I've been in low sec and there I get about 6K per extractor head if im very lucky. but im willing to accept that 19.2K P0 per hour per extractor head in a wormhole is possible esp if you use less then 24h cycles. I haven't been in null or wh planets to see what they produce.
But still I think it is very unlike you are making 160m ISK a day by producing robotics on two planets, using only a single character to feed all the factories. The math is is that you need 3 times more megawatts then 6 elite command centers can produce.
I think your calculations are off by about a factor of 3-5. I will assume you made a miscalculation and in this I think im being very optimistic.
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LaneHacker
Band of Freelancers Turdz Asshatz N Grieferz
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Posted - 2011.01.28 00:28:00 -
[10]
Over 9000!!!
=The original jet-can specialist= |
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Chong Woon
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Posted - 2011.01.28 02:47:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Chong Woon on 28/01/2011 02:47:39 My Low sec PI (which makes robotics and coolant). With my set up I can earn around 130 to 160mil in around a week's time, modest, but I only put in an hour or so every couple days to haul the stuff and sneaking past gate camps is half the fun of it for me
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DontLaseMeBro
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Posted - 2011.01.28 03:13:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Ilena Grace Edited by: Ilena Grace on 28/01/2011 00:16:59 160 mil / day. robotics cost 60K 160.000.000 / 60.000 = 4.000 robotics a day 4.000 / [24 hours in a day] = 160 / hour 160 / [5 Robotics per factory] = [32 advanced factories] making robotics [32 * 4 factories producing the P2 input product] = 128 advanced factories making the P2 128 basic industries making the P1
I'm not usually real big on people correcting other people for grammar or whatnot, but, if you are going to put out all these calculations and math, please do the math correctly. 160 mill isk at 60k a unit is not 4000 robotics a day, it is 2,666 a day. That one error destroys the whole rest of you chain of equations there.
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Chelone
Ministry of War
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Posted - 2011.01.28 03:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Greg Huff 42
That's the old numbers before it was nerfed. More like 27 now.
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Zircalla
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Posted - 2011.01.28 13:40:00 -
[14]
Opps, I did make a math error there - I counted all my advanced factories for my two robotics planets, but then doubled it again thinking I had only counted on of them. It should have been 168 mil/2, or about 84 mil. The number did look a bit wrong, but I typically only sell them every week or two (and mixed in w/ other alts and friends PI) and haven't really worked the new numbers yet anyway.
I have a total of 12 factories making robotics, for 60 per hour.
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Jun Pellion
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Posted - 2011.01.28 16:33:00 -
[15]
Originally by: OracleOfJita Counting only the on-going costs of buying raw materials in Jita, and assuming transport is free, how much can I expect to make, roughly, doing full PI/invention/manufacturing on my char?
I realize there's a lot of variables here, but I just want a rough range of how well the science/industrial side of EVE pays.
Something around losing all and a couple billions a day, depending on investment, number of chars, items you invent/manufacture, and PI resources you take.
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Aldor
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Posted - 2011.01.28 16:35:00 -
[16]
Before the patch I was doing this with 3 accounts part time. I manufactured t2 modules and ammo. I ran the whole op, the only thing I bought off the market were moon components & mins. All RAM, etc I manufactured on my own. I never really did pay attention to my profits since as I got enough money I entered into a new t2 product. I started with 1 invention line about June last year. By around November I took a hiatus and quit EVE. When I quit I had 6 modules and 3 ammo invention runs I was doing. Again I bought the BPOs to run the whole job from making t2 components from moon material to invention to manufacturing.. I had 30 slots running non stop when I quit.
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