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Bel Rigean
Gallente GoldLeaf Industries
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:43:00 -
[1]
Sansha Incursion are invading agent missions!!
It seems that if an agent mission involves mining in anyway, a Sansha fleet (with a battleship) warps in once the mining cycle is finished. They start pounding your ship within 2 seconds of their arrival. That's REALLY fast target locking.
If they are suppose to invade all parts of the game in Incursion effected systems, then at least be fair about it. I was in a level 1 agent mission when this happened to me. I lost my Vexor because I didn't expect to be thrown up against a battleship on this type of mission.
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Vhan
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:45:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Bel Rigean Sansha Incursion are invading agent missions!!
It seems that if an agent mission involves mining in anyway, a Sansha fleet (with a battleship) warps in once the mining cycle is finished. They start pounding your ship within 2 seconds of their arrival. That's REALLY fast target locking.
If they are suppose to invade all parts of the game in Incursion effected systems, then at least be fair about it. I was in a level 1 agent mission when this happened to me. I lost my Vexor because I didn't expect to be thrown up against a battleship on this type of mission.
Screenshot/video or it didn't happen! :) - Vhan |
Stu Pendisdick
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:45:00 -
[3]
Oops?
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!
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Bongo Debbie
Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:47:00 -
[4]
You want CCP to defend your ignorance?
When a new feature comes along it is a good idea to read up about it.
----
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Takseen
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:51:00 -
[5]
It makes sense. Mining anywhere has a chance to trigger a rat spawn, even in mission space. And in Incursion systems, regular belt rats are replaced by SuperFun SuperSansha ships. Enjoy!
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Edgar Berberos
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:57:00 -
[6]
Sanshas attack unsuspecting miners in the trailer. Working as intended :)
Incursion trailer
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Verone
Gallente Veto Corp
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Posted - 2011.01.27 17:59:00 -
[7]
Epic
>>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<< |
HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:02:00 -
[8]
Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:08:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Bongo Debbie You want CCP to defend your ignorance?
When a new feature comes along it is a good idea to read up about it.
While in hindsight Takseen post give a good explanation, in the blog and multiple CCP employees comments there is nothing about Sansha ships invading missions.
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Bongo Debbie
Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:13:00 -
[10]
There is however everything about them taking over SYSTEMS. Guess what that means for people mining in an invaded system? ----
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Stu Pendisdick
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:18:00 -
[11]
Yeah, *BUT*
Unless and until they start attacking POS and OUTPOSTS and SOV STRUCTURES, it's just more gravy in the pockets of the huge nullsec alliances who own all the moon goo for the T2 ships/mods/ammo and the rest of us, again, get shat upon.
But we know THAT will never happen, 'cuz certain HVAC systems sales and repair owners are so deep up CCP's rear end that they will never have to worry about such trivial matters.
And that's the TRUTH.
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LaneHacker
Band of Freelancers Turdz Asshatz N Grieferz
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:20:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Bel Rigean Sansha Incursion are invading agent missions!!
It seems that if an agent mission involves mining in anyway, a Sansha fleet (with a battleship) warps in once the mining cycle is finished. They start pounding your ship within 2 seconds of their arrival. That's REALLY fast target locking.
If they are suppose to invade all parts of the game in Incursion effected systems, then at least be fair about it. I was in a level 1 agent mission when this happened to me. I lost my Vexor because I didn't expect to be thrown up against a battleship on this type of mission.
That's what you get for mining and running missions!!
=The original jet-can specialist= |
Alexliea
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:21:00 -
[13]
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:23:00 -
[14]
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
You might check your logic skill on that one Hell.. it's faulty. Ships exploding are a mineral sink and an isk faucet at best.. but definitely not an isk sink. Moron.
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
mechtech
SRS Industries SRS.
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:25:00 -
[15]
If this is true, it's totally awesome.
I was afraid Sansha incursions would be nothing mroe than glorified open access dungeons. The sansha are supposed to be invading the incursion area, they should be doing things like this.
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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:27:00 -
[16]
Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:34:35 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:29:28
Originally by: Alexliea
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mongo dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
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Mina Hiragi
Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:29:00 -
[17]
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
It's an ISK faucet, not a sink. Insurance creates ISK, and loss of minerals != loss of ISK.
BTW, if you're not finding it fun, maybe you should, I dunno, learn what every player should know within their first week of play - how to use the map? EVE has no shortage of systems, y'know.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:31:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Bongo Debbie There is however everything about them taking over SYSTEMS. Guess what that means for people mining in an invaded system?
Mining in a belt =/= mining in mission space =/= mining in exploration sites
Quote: Active incursions will bring a variety of disruptive changes that will greatly impact player activities; first off, celestial pirate NPCs you would normally encounter at star gates and asteroid belts will be replaced by new ones tied with the incursion, and they will demonstrate updated attributes and Sleeper-like AI.
The quote from the Sansha blog above clearly state "NPCs you would normally encounter at star gates and asteroid belts will be replaced". If something different was implemented there was no way for the player to know beforehand seeing how this is a computer game where reality is shaped by what the developers implement.
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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:32:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Mina Hiragi
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
It's an ISK faucet, not a sink. Insurance creates ISK, and loss of minerals != loss of ISK.
BTW, if you're not finding it fun, maybe you should, I dunno, learn what every player should know within their first week of play - how to use the map? EVE has no shortage of systems, y'know.
You might be right or wrong I don't know.I assume most don't insure their ships.And yes I'm very able to use a map and do so thank you.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:36:00 -
[20]
Originally by: HeIIfire11
Originally by: Alexliea
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mong dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
Aaahw.. butthurt my dear? Can't deal with mistakes made by yourself? By the way, even uninsured ships generate isk, it's the basic payout you get. So again you got no clue what you're talking about.
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
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Bel Rigean
Gallente GoldLeaf Industries
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:41:00 -
[21]
First - thanks for all the sympathy from my fellow capsuleers.
Second - Part 2 of 5 of the Suntendi Recall mission involves mining Plagioclase for the agent in a mission specific location. I had already done this mission in incursion space before without the Sansha showing up before 1.1.2 deployed. The release notes made no mention of this new twist. Also, all the other agent missions that do not involve mining, don't have the Sansha crashing the party.
I know enough not to do regular mining in incursion space because of the Sansha rats. So if the Sansha now show up even during mission mining, then there will be a lot of declined or unfinished missions in incursion space.
This game is still a blast to play, it was just surprising to see a battleship in a level 1 mission.
Now to make the Sansha pay for blowing up my ship
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Funesta
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:41:00 -
[22]
Belt rats have always invaded mining missions. Now, in Sansha incursions, the belt rats get replaced by Sansha. Thus, the mining mission rats are Sansha. This should be no surprise.
If you don't want to risk the Sansha battleship, don't do mining missions in 0.5 systems. I haven't seen any Sansha battleships in belts in 0.6 or higher - though that might be subject to the incursion type rather than the system security, I'm not positive. Either way, Sansha battleships don't appear everywhere.
Just do your missions elsewhere. It's not that hard.
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mkmin
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:41:00 -
[23]
All regular 'belt rats' are replaced by Sansha. Mining missions ALWAYS use regular belt rats. Mining missions in 0.9 and higher will not spawn any rats, missions lower will ALWAYS have 1 spawn of rats.
Never really thought about it but I'm not 'lolwut' surprised either. IMO working as intended.
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Val'Dore
Word Bearers of Chaos
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:41:00 -
[24]
Maybe we should push for galaxy wide Incursions.
~No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously.~ |
HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: HeIIfire11
Originally by: Alexliea
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mong dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
Aaahw.. butthurt my dear? Can't deal with mistakes made by yourself? By the way, even uninsured ships generate isk, it's the basic payout you get. So again you got no clue what you're talking about.
You don't by far amount to enough to even remotly cause any butt hurt.And do I look like my name is Tippia? No..I could care less about being wrong,more so in some random inet forum.
And about the isk..the last ship I lost costed me around 700 mill and was fit for about another 200 mill.I got 50 mill uninsured.Don't see your point to be honest.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:44:00 -
[26]
ooo They should make Sansha attack a POS...people will have to online their guns now. - - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Taedrin
Gallente The Green Cross Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:49:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Taedrin on 27/01/2011 18:50:05 EDIT: I'm sure that Akita T could explain this far better than I could. Where is Akita when you need him?
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:34:35 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:29:28
Originally by: Alexliea
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mongo dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
When you buy a ship, you lose ISK, but that ISK goes to another player - thus the ISK does not disappear from the economy.
When your ship blows up, the ISK that you used to purchase that ship also does not suddenly disappear (manufacturers would be in big trouble if this were the case!), so thus your ship being blown up does not act as an ISK sink. The only thing that is destroyed are the minerals that were mined/refined in order to build your ship.
However, when your ship is destroyed, you receive an insurance payout (even if you didn't insure it!) which creates ISK out of thin air.
Thus, thanks to insurance payouts, a ship being blown up is an ISK faucet, not an ISK sink. However, it acts as a mineral sink. This has a twofold effect: 1) Supply of minerals in the market is reduced, thus increasing mineral prices 2) Supply of money in the mineral market is increased, causing inflation which further increases mineral prices.
This is why wars, incursions and anything which involve people getting their ships blown up are good for miners and industrialists in general. In fact, if you pay attention to mineral prices during major 0.0 wars, you will notice that mineral prices rise very quickly. Remember The Great Tritanium Shortage? Trit prices over 4 ISK per unit, pyerite over 8? Those prices were only possible due to two reasons: 1) Lots of capital ships being blown up in 0.0 2) Back at that time, insurance payouts weren't nerfed, so there was a floor on the mineral basket price ----------
Originally by: Dr Fighter "how do you know when youve had a repro accident"
Theres modules missing and morphite in your mineral pile.
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Edgar Berberos
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:52:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Stu Pendis**** Unless and until they start attacking POS and OUTPOSTS and SOV STRUCTURES, it's just more gravy in the pockets of the huge nullsec alliances who own all the moon goo for the T2 ships/mods/ammo and the rest of us, again, get shat upon.
Now. I'm under the impressions that in some cases rats do attack POSses at least. Sleepers in w-space was it? Now, why wouldn't The Nation do the same.
Please do correct me if I'm wrong.
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mkmin
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:54:00 -
[29]
Originally by: HeIIfire11
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: HeIIfire11
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mong dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
Aaahw.. butthurt my dear? Can't deal with mistakes made by yourself? By the way, even uninsured ships generate isk, it's the basic payout you get. So again you got no clue what you're talking about.
You don't by far amount to enough to even remotly cause any butt hurt.And do I look like my name is Tippia? No..I could care less about being wrong,more so in some random inet forum.
And about the isk..the last ship I lost costed me around 700 mill and was fit for about another 200 mill.I got 50 mill uninsured.Don't see your point to be honest.
Isk faucet is isk faucet, and people who aren't butthurt when their faults are pointed out don't respond with attacks.
Isk/material sinks/faucets are based on when isk/materials are introduced to the entire game itself. Losing your ship, the entire game gets more isk for insurance, even if it was only 0.1 isk for a ship that cost 100 buzillion isk worth of MATERIALS, it's still an ISK faucet. It's not like you get charged a "CONCORD OMGWTF you suck" fee for dying. You just lose the MATERIAL that was built into a ship.
So, howsabout you rub both brain cells together and try to understand what you're talking about before you make yourself look like a tool trying to defend intelligent design... err... poorly thought out positions.
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Mina Hiragi
Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:55:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Mina Hiragi on 27/01/2011 18:56:45
Originally by: HeIIfire11 You might be right or wrong I don't know.I assume most don't insure their ships.And yes I'm very able to use a map and do so thank you.
I, for one, can't be arsed to insure my ships. I always fear I won't get blown up before it expires, and I have ethical problems with blowing up my own ships just to scam poor, hardworking insurance agents.
But anyway - if one loses a ship and has to buy a new ship or new minerals/components to build a ship, you're spending ISK, to be sure. But that ISK is not disappearing from the game world - it's merely transferring from your hands to some other player or players' hands. There is the issue of sales tax, however - which does mean market purchases are very minimally an ISK sink, if taken alone.
Insurance, on the other hand - even if you're uninsured, there's still the basic payout. When you lose a ship, the insurance system magically conjures ISK out of thin air and dumps it into the wallet. It creates ISK that was not previously in the game world. Thus, faucet.
I'm willing to bet that insurance payouts more than counteract taxes on purchases, so in general, Incursion is indeed acting as an ISK faucet. A mere leaky faucet rather than one gushing at full blast, but a faucet nonetheless.
Edit: And as a brief browse through the market forums will tell you, low margin, uber-high volume transactions are what separate the Internet Spaceships Hotdog Carts from the Internet Spaceships Walmarts.
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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 18:57:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Taedrin Edited by: Taedrin on 27/01/2011 18:50:05 EDIT: I'm sure that Akita T could explain this far better than I could. Where is Akita when you need him?
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:34:35 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 18:29:28
Originally by: Alexliea
Originally by: HeIIfire11 Oh joy!! Because its so fun to be surprised by a fleet of super rats while mining.What fun..what fun!Moar content ccp!!
Moooaaaarr!!
Nice isk sink btw.
idiots need to stop calling ship kills isk sinks since they are actually isk faucets.
idiots also need to stop thinking everyone is as much of an idiot as they are
Same goes for the friut fly Tres..you can call your mongo dad a moron.
Wrong or right who died and made you god?
When you buy a ship, you lose ISK, but that ISK goes to another player - thus the ISK does not disappear from the economy.
When your ship blows up, the ISK that you used to purchase that ship also does not suddenly disappear (manufacturers would be in big trouble if this were the case!), so thus your ship being blown up does not act as an ISK sink. The only thing that is destroyed are the minerals that were mined/refined in order to build your ship.
However, when your ship is destroyed, you receive an insurance payout (even if you didn't insure it!) which creates ISK out of thin air.
Thus, thanks to insurance payouts, a ship being blown up is an ISK faucet, not an ISK sink. However, it acts as a mineral sink. This has a twofold effect: 1) Supply of minerals in the market is reduced, thus increasing mineral prices 2) Supply of money in the mineral market is increased, causing inflation which further increases mineral prices.
This is why wars, incursions and anything which involve people getting their ships blown up are good for miners and industrialists in general. In fact, if you pay attention to mineral prices during major 0.0 wars, you will notice that mineral prices rise very quickly. Remember The Great Tritanium Shortage? Trit prices over 4 ISK per unit, pyerite over 8? Those prices were only possible due to two reasons: 1) Lots of capital ships being blown up in 0.0 2) Back at that time, insurance payouts weren't nerfed, so there was a floor on the mineral basket price
ok I get what your saying and I stand corrected.It makes the expansion even more fail in that case
I dont do the market or mining or production so I wouldn't know.I log in train skills and blow stuff up.Thx for clearing that up
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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.01.27 19:01:00 -
[32]
Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 19:03:44 Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 27/01/2011 19:03:07
Originally by: mkmin
Isk faucet is isk faucet, and people who aren't butthurt when their faults are pointed out don't respond with attacks.
And you have peole all figured out? I respond to being called an idiot and a moron with attacks yes.Don't mistake my response as a sign of being butt hurt,or do If you like tbh like I said I really couldn't care less.
So take your last brain cell and rub it against the wall(it will have to do) and try to understand that
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.01.27 19:01:00 -
[33]
Originally by: HeIIfire11 *snip* I may be wrong and if so..hey you were right!Go tell mongo you deserve a cookie
Apology accepted
Any chance, that there would be milk with the cookie?
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Vincent Athena
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Posted - 2011.01.27 19:19:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Vincent Athena on 27/01/2011 19:25:14
Originally by: Edgar Berberos
Originally by: Stu Pendis**** Unless and until they start attacking POS and OUTPOSTS and SOV STRUCTURES, it's just more gravy in the pockets of the huge nullsec alliances who own all the moon goo for the T2 ships/mods/ammo and the rest of us, again, get shat upon.
Now. I'm under the impressions that in some cases rats do attack POSses at least. Sleepers in w-space was it? Now, why wouldn't The Nation do the same.
Please do correct me if I'm wrong.
Our POS in a C3 w-system has never been attacked by sleepers.
Edit: BTW I would still like to hear from CCP: Did you consider mission and exploration belts when you had Sanshas replace normal rats? Is this a surprise to you? Or is it "working as intended"? Personally, I think its working as intended, but it would have been nice if the description of what happens to belt rats had mentioned that it applies to mission and exploration belts too.
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Bel Rigean
Gallente GoldLeaf Industries
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Posted - 2011.01.30 15:22:00 -
[35]
Here is the official response from the powers that be..,
Quote: Hi! It is by design, that you can be attacked by deadly Sansha NPCs in mining missions in incursions systems. They really donŠt like mining - it doesnŠt matter if you are in an asteroid belt or in a mining mission. - Best Regards, CCP Habakuk
...but still, a battleship in a level 1 mission? These Sansha's MUST stopped!!!
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Dr Sheepbringer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.30 17:48:00 -
[36]
Mining under wartime and you are complaning the bad guys came. Oh my. That's harsh. Perhaps you should petition it and ask them to shoot gummybears against missioners.
Originally by: CCP Shadow Dr. Sheepbringer -- It's not that kind of horn.
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Bel Rigean
Gallente GoldLeaf Industries
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Posted - 2011.01.30 22:58:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Bel Rigean on 30/01/2011 22:58:20 I wasn't complaining...I was just questioning the arrival of Sansha during a mission. According to what I read up to this incident, Sansha would not replace mission NPCs or show up along side mission NPCs. Now I find out there was an unwritten exception to this, which is mining will trigger the arrival of the Sansha in incursion space regardless of where you do it. So I now understand that no mining is safe in incursion space and if it part of a mission hold off on it until the Sansha leave the area or bring PLENTY of backup. If a battleship will show up in a level 1 mission, what should you expect in a level 2 mission? a Dreadnought?
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Yalneg Splet
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Posted - 2011.01.30 23:40:00 -
[38]
Whatever our personal opinions are, and whether we like carebear tears or not, the whole concept seems anti-new player. It's basically a way for NPCs to get away with what real players cannot. And that is gank random noobs in level 1 missions with no Concord penalty.
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Infinity Ziona
Minmatar Cloakers
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Posted - 2011.01.30 23:45:00 -
[39]
Just move to another non-incursion system I guess.
--------------------------------------------- I AM BETTER THAN YOU. |
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