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SweetHoney
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Posted - 2010.12.16 04:44:00 -
[1]
Don't know who else noticed but after undocking I get more than 5 degrees deviation. I just noticed becasue I using the same insta un**** bookmark all the time and now took forever to warp.. which was weird... So I did dock/undock couple of times to check it.. and I do 45 degrees sometimes now ! amazing :)
Looks like insta undock won't work 100% anymore.
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Hired Assasin
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Posted - 2010.12.16 04:46:00 -
[2]
u mad bro?
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Schalac
Caldari Apocalypse Reign
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Posted - 2010.12.16 04:47:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Hired Assasin u mad bro?
This is game changing. Why wouldn't you be mad? SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN |
Snowmann
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Posted - 2010.12.16 05:02:00 -
[4]
I'm calling BS. I tested some of my insta BMs and had none of the issues mentioned.
One possibility is that BMs may have drifted or grid has moved for OP. I've seen what seemed like a 10AU+ shift in some of my BMs in the past, possibly due to data coruption I guess. Very rare though.
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SweetHoney
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Posted - 2010.12.16 05:05:00 -
[5]
Edited by: SweetHoney on 16/12/2010 05:05:30 Go dock and un-dock couple of times and check your launching angles. It was 5-15 degrees before .. now can be 45 deg. |
Schalac
Caldari Apocalypse Reign
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Posted - 2010.12.16 05:08:00 -
[6]
The systems are a changing. I blame gravity, and orbits. Imagine if EVE solar systems actually orbited the star. Now that would be worth an update. SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN |
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.12.16 06:02:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 16/12/2010 06:03:40 You undock plus/minus 15 degree from the undocking normal of the stations undocking ramp. This means your InstaUndock-bm can't cover all possible angles any more, as that instant warp only works for plus/minus 5 degrees directional difference of warp-vector vs ship-pointing-direction. This has been around for some time now.
Solution? You now need around 7-9 bookmarks to get real instantUndock-bms again. In a distance of 1000km from the station you get one in the middle (normal from ramp at 0 degree) and the other 8 placed around it on a circle of about 185km radius, perpendicular to the station. Seen from the undock ramp this spaces them ~10 degree apart.
For 9 bookmarks this would look like this:
[TOP] - . - '' . (naming of bookmarks done for looking 142km . at your ship during undocking TOWARDS station) - '' . - '' . [TOP <<=] . [TOP =>>] .. . . . . . . . . 185km . . . . . . . . . . 185km . 185km . . . . 132km . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ... [<<=]...........185km.............[CTR]...........185km.............[=>>] ... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 185km . 185km . . . . . . . 185km . . . . . . . [DWN <<=] . [DWN =>>] . . . . (CTR being 1,000km from undock ramp) . [DWN]
Have fun doing this. I already made them for 3 stations.. one of the ORE stations included The first runs need jetcans as helpers, additional to the tactical overview.. from there on you should be able to do this without cans completely cloacked. It took me about 2 hours with a stealth bomber, fitted unprobeable/speed to make the ORE station ones btw.
Usage: Once you undock you see how your ship starts to point it's nose. Then rclick and choose the bookmark which resembles that direction.
Some 360deg background mesh sphere when in tactical overview would be very helpful. Also some smaller units for horizontal angles, instead of the 90deg we have now would be cool also. There are some highlightes points on the circles of the tactical overview range rings, but they don't match 5deg. They're good enough though to get some 20 deg out of the interface though..
The undocking ramp normal of some stations isn't plain straight ahead either. Some caldari station which looks like a big blown up drake shoots you out at an upwards angle of at least 30-40 deg. Wait for the NPC trading ships to get the normal for that one.
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Wiki Leaks
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Posted - 2010.12.16 09:52:00 -
[8]
This has credibility.
1. Identifies an Eve Cancer. 2. Suggests without evidence that CCP have addressed it. 3. Suggests CCP address demonstrates CCP's standard inability to identify the problem. 4. Continues into the inevitable bookmark spam that non-orbitting static orbitals will inevitably always result in.
Make things orbit. Even 1 metre per minute is plenty. Then you can bring make warp to 15km without any bookmarks being useful.
I'm saying 6 or 7/10 |
TimMc
Brutal Deliverance Extreme Prejudice.
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Posted - 2010.12.16 11:27:00 -
[9]
Originally by: SweetHoney Don't know who else noticed but after undocking I get more than 5 degrees deviation. I just noticed becasue I using the same insta un**** bookmark all the time and now took forever to warp.. which was weird... So I did dock/undock couple of times to check it.. and I do 45 degrees sometimes now ! amazing :)
Looks like insta undock won't work 100% anymore.
Do you realise how large 45 degrees is?
And insta undocks have been iffy anyway for a while, you just have to fly a vaguely quick ship and you should align to bookmark before most people can lock.
Especially true in lowsec where ceptors cannot operate.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.12.16 12:29:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 16/12/2010 12:35:41
Originally by: Wiki Leaks Make things orbit. Even 1 metre per minute is plenty. Then you can bring make warp to 15km without any bookmarks being useful.
Hey, bring it on. I'm all for it. Those calculations for all those planets, moons, stations, pos, etc. can't be that hard. Destiny is able to track 1500 ship + countless other balls in a system. That hand full of celestials shouldn't add much load.
But I'm pretty sure, that the submarine-space-mechanics of Eve wont take this so easy.. the moons orbit speed around earth is about 1km/s. Try to camp that stations undocking ramp with your ship, if the station itself orbits the moon at an additional 500m/s. Docking can probably solved by warping in front of the station, as it moves along. Will give you a time window of about 10-15 secs till you're out of docking range.
Btw, if you're going for slower orbit speeds, so that station camping is possible at.. let's say 100m/s.. then I'd demand a warp into any direction option. Point your ship to the 2nd star to the right and hit the button, see where it goes.
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Space Pinata
Amarr Discount Napkin Industries
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Posted - 2010.12.16 13:22:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 16/12/2010 12:35:41
Originally by: Wiki Leaks Make things orbit. Even 1 metre per minute is plenty. Then you can bring make warp to 15km without any bookmarks being useful.
Hey, bring it on. I'm all for it. Those calculations for all those planets, moons, stations, pos, etc. can't be that hard. Destiny is able to track 1500 ship + countless other balls in a system. That hand full of celestials shouldn't add much load.
But I'm pretty sure, that the submarine-space-mechanics of Eve wont take this so easy.. the moons orbit speed around earth is about 1km/s. Try to camp that stations undocking ramp with your ship, if the station itself orbits the moon at an additional 500m/s. Docking can probably solved by warping in front of the station, as it moves along. Will give you a time window of about 10-15 secs till you're out of docking range.
Btw, if you're going for slower orbit speeds, so that station camping is possible at.. let's say 100m/s.. then I'd demand a warp into any direction option. Point your ship to the 2nd star to the right and hit the button, see where it goes.
You could assume your ship is in orbit too, and thus immobile relative to the station. This means more movement calculations for every ship.
Won't change much.
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Wiki Leaks
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Posted - 2010.12.16 13:27:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 16/12/2010 12:35:41
Originally by: Wiki Leaks Make things orbit. Even 1 metre per minute is plenty. Then you can bring make warp to 15km without any bookmarks being useful.
Hey, bring it on. I'm all for it. Those calculations for all those planets, moons, stations, pos, etc. can't be that hard. Destiny is able to track 1500 ship + countless other balls in a system. That hand full of celestials shouldn't add much load.
But I'm pretty sure, that the submarine-space-mechanics of Eve wont take this so easy.. the moons orbit speed around earth is about 1km/s. Try to camp that stations undocking ramp with your ship, if the station itself orbits the moon at an additional 500m/s. Docking can probably solved by warping in front of the station, as it moves along. Will give you a time window of about 10-15 secs till you're out of docking range.
Btw, if you're going for slower orbit speeds, so that station camping is possible at.. let's say 100m/s.. then I'd demand a warp into any direction option. Point your ship to the 2nd star to the right and hit the button, see where it goes.
aye... I wasn't after a semi real orbit mechanic. Also, if the station orbits at 500m/s, then so would all the ships launching from it, thus the relative speed from station to ship is still only the speed vector set by the ship, and thus would have no effect on camping a station, except if you warp in, you would have to get up to speed first. Unless warp mechanics were "RP'd" into making you set velocity to match the destination most people would find navigation exceptionally difficult, Elite:Frontier had it done pretty good, and it was basically impossible without auto pilot. Since nobody would notice the actual velocity otherwise, it might as well not be there.
I was only really offering something about making bookmark spam so irrelevant nobody would do it. If yesterday's bookmarks didn't work today, and wouldn't be valid again until the year 3000 people might not make them. Some would of course. You cannot legislate against insanity.
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Green-Core The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.16 13:51:00 -
[13]
Used a couple of my insta undocks yesterday - they all worked fine. --Vel
I'm more of a care-badger. |
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.12.16 14:12:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Space Pinata You could assume your ship is in orbit too, and thus immobile relative to the station. This means more movement calculations for every ship.
Won't change much.
As of the mechanics Eve is build on this could become a problem with the grids. By now these virtual areas of local action are relatively static. They can be extended or squished. They can separate. But so far they can't move.
You now can apply this 'orbiting a moving station with 0m/s on your speedometer'. What with the mechanics then? Does the whole grid with it's contents move? What if there is another in the way? How should the mechanic react in this case? Or do the objects on the grid move, while the old grid will be left back and a new one will be opened approx every 700km? How do you decide then which objects are orbiting and which don't?
Originally by: Wiki Leaks aye... I wasn't after a semi real orbit mechanic. Also, if the station orbits at 500m/s, then so would all the ships launching from it, thus the relative speed from station to ship is still only the speed vector set by the ship, and thus would have no effect on camping a station, except if you warp in, you would have to get up to speed first. Unless warp mechanics were "RP'd" into making you set velocity to match the destination most people would find navigation exceptionally difficult, Elite:Frontier had it done pretty good, and it was basically impossible without auto pilot. Since nobody would notice the actual velocity otherwise, it might as well not be there.
Not with Eves submarine physics.. If your ship can't handle the orbiting speed of the station, or what ever you're trying to keep at distance, you'll be outrun. Try to keep up with a shuttle that moves at 500m/s when you sit in a battleship
Originally by: Wiki Leaks I was only really offering something about making bookmark spam so irrelevant nobody would do it. If yesterday's bookmarks didn't work today, and wouldn't be valid again until the year 3000 people might not make them. Some would of course. You cannot legislate against insanity.
I hope the CSM proposal for corporation bm's will do some good to this, at least in w-space.
The overall idea of getting rid of those static coordinates is very arousing to me. I'd be all for it, but it seems not that easy.
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