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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
I think we should be given an option to either upvote or downvote a single post. I believe it would serve a different purpose than the somewhat controversial "likes" system as well as promote better quality posts.
Here is my current dilemma:
When I participate in a heated discussion where there is clearly two sides, I usually tend to "like" the posts I agree with and the ones which are well-constructed. Occasionally I might even like a post which completely disagrees with my statement simply because it is well-thought, intelligent and brings something new to the discussion.
What I would like to see is a system where I can "rate highly" a certain post without necessarily "liking" it. There should also be an option to "rate low" posts which are clearly trolling or being outright disrespectful.
Here are the definitive advantages once this is implemented: - Being able to sort bigger threads by hiding low-rated posts and/or showing highest-rated only. Especially useful when reading a long thread for the first time and trying to get the general direction it is heading. - Making CCP's and ISD's job easier when characters seem to accumulate dozens of low-rated posts (troll detection). - Favoring quality over quantity; instead of posting your ideas with 5 posts in a thread, it would be preferential to make a single post if you wish your points to be more visible. - Rating should be anonymous and one-per-account - Longer posts/OPs would be much easier to sort (to read or not to read, that is the question) - Not to mention "highly rated" posts would make DEVs jobs easier when looking for constructive feedback. - Gives you the chance to show appreciation to opposition's arguments without making them think you agree with their points. - Since making "highly rated" posts takes an effort and would be reserved to ranking a single post each time, it would be impossible to farm unless you actually create dozens of "highly rated" posts, which is actually a good thing.
I think "liking" posts should be reserved to funny, clever and truly outstanding posts and thus remain as is. It shows that character is active on the forums and the sheer quantity of his likes proves they are aware of the current trends and events.
Whatcha' guys think? |
Ghost Frog
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'm sure no one will game the system. This is EVE after all. |
Sexy Cakes
Poasting
26
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
I think there was a dislike function briefly if I remember correctly. Probably got abused and taken out.
But really like/dislike or rate high/rate low whats the difference?
I agree on hiding low rated/disliked posts though. |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ghost Frog wrote:I'm sure no one will game the system. This is EVE after all.
Thor Kerrigan wrote: - Since making "highly rated" posts takes an effort and would be reserved to ranking a single post each time, it would be impossible to farm unless you actually create dozens of "highly rated" posts, which is actually a good thing.
As I said, "gaming the system" would not actually be a bad thing in perspective. |
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
591
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
I agree, the system will be too easy to game and the quality still wouldn't be separated from the crap. |
Quaaid
EVE Pilot Help Center
92
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
I can't downvote this idea. |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:37:00 -
[7] - Quote
Sexy Cakes wrote:I think there was a dislike function briefly if I remember correctly. Probably got abused and taken out.
But really like/dislike or rate high/rate low whats the difference?
I agree on hiding low rated/disliked posts though.
Yes they are similar but my main issue with the liking system is that it is cumulative.
If I see a character with 500 likes to his character, I have no way to see if it is 500 posts with 1 like each or 2 posts with 250+ likes. Only one scenario is truly impressive.
I could, of course, read all the posts of a certain character but why not implement a rating system instead? It's convenient. |
VanDam
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
20
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:38:00 -
[8] - Quote
I would like the functionality to hide specific threads. Those that come to mind are the 'rate your avatar' ones and threads by known trolls. |
Lilliana Stelles
Mindstar Technology Executive Outcomes
323
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
I'm not reading this thread as you lack the likes to earn my attention. |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Micheal Dietrich wrote:I agree, the system will be too easy to game and the quality still wouldn't be separated from the crap.
What is the point of gaming the system if all your millions of "highly rated" posts don't show up unless someone actually searches for your character?
And even if you did, it would only take a person 30 secs to read 2-3 of your farming posts to see what is going on and forget your name.
Quaaid wrote:I can't downvote this idea.
But then again, maybe it would have been upvoted 5 times for each downvote. We will never know. |
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Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
1249
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:42:00 -
[11] - Quote
so you want to turn this forum into Reddit? My homeboys tried to warn me But that butt you got makes me so horny |
Grandpa Bill
Twin Lakes Retirement Home
417
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:45:00 -
[12] - Quote
I like the way the chat forums things are but mostly cause I better understand how they work and such. Took me awhile to figure em out you see. My Grandson Billy told me how to use em a few times but in the end I think I got it and if yer make too many changes I'll probably have to bug Jimmy again. But he's a good grandson so he wont mind I guess. Enter in Grandpa Bill's FREE Weekly Drawin(8/10/12 Drawings will be for 9 T1 Mining Barges. -áThats 9 free drawings in one week!) Enter today! |
Sarik Olecar
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
81
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:46:00 -
[13] - Quote
Came here expecting official KB/Leaderboards. Left indifferent... |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:47:00 -
[14] - Quote
What I want is a system where I can search for "highest rated" posts. Could be in a single thread, in a forum section, during that specific day, best of the month, etc.
Searching for "most liked" posts would seem like a waste of time since it is restricted to "going upwards only" and very timezone-dependent. |
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
591
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 15:56:00 -
[15] - Quote
Thor Kerrigan wrote:Micheal Dietrich wrote:I agree, the system will be too easy to game and the quality still wouldn't be separated from the crap. What is the point of gaming the system if all your millions of "highly rated" posts don't show up unless someone actually searches for your character? And even if you did, it would only take a person 30 secs to read 2-3 of your farming posts to see what is going on and forget your name.
What would be the point of the system then?
And we can that information without some special point system. Whenever I read a post by somebody and I'm not too sure about their intention I usually check out the first page of their post history to get a better idea. To me this is the same as our current likes system which personally speaking is nothing more than a popularity contest. Lets say somebody from a very well known major alliance decides to shiptoast in a anti-well known major alliance thread, you may decide to down vote but 25 of his friends and 8 of his alts will up vote. Now imagine that when they are upvoting each other on each post. At which point the whole idea of separating good posts from bad post by the clicky system becomes moot and you are back to deciding the quality of a post with your own judgement again. |
Ghost Frog
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2012.08.08 16:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
any system that relies on clicks from hoards of alts is doomed to failure |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
197
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Posted - 2012.08.08 16:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
But wouldn't it being anonymous and one-per-account work as a damage control II?
Sure you could farm it with your alliance, but the point is to keep it local to the actual post unlike the likes system which is bound to character.
So you manage to ask your entire alliance to log-in on the forums and upvote your post. Then you ask them to switch accounts and do so with their alts. Okay, it works once, point made, you have an artificial "highly rated" post.
Now do this a second time.
Now try it a third time.
Do you think that the fourth time you ask all your alliance members to do it again you will have the same numbers as during your first try? No. While your artificial alliance alts diminish gradually, the amount of active forum posters remains the same and they will keep downvoting obvious attempts at popularity.
Bottom line, after a month you are back at square one. If none of your posts were actually constructive, chances are no one will remember you even tried it at all.
The cumulative and permanent aspect of the likes system is what makes it farmable with a few of these "popularity contests". An upvote/downvote system that resets after each post makes it extremely tedious and time-consuming to keep farming efficiently. |
Jame Jarl Retief
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
216
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Posted - 2012.08.08 16:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
Trouble with rating of posts is that typically it results in a very rigid forum dogma that gets enforced by the ratings.
To give you an example, suppose the "popular" opinion is that the Tengu could use a big fat nerf. Whether true or not, anyone saying Tengu is fine is going to collect a lot of negative ratings. And it doesn't matter if he's right or wrong, just the simple fact that he is saying something contrary to the "popular" opinion is going to get him stoned to death on the forum. And this is just a "human nature" problem, without any planning or real ill intent.
But once you factor in certain people using their corps, alliances and their respective alts to upvote utter nonsense just to turn whatever decision in their favour, using it as a tool to guide the Devs, it is going to be a gory mess.
Honestly I don't see this working out well.
Take me for instance. I don't think EVE is particularly hard, or all that challenging. I just see it as needlessly complicated. Like pulling a wisdom tooth. You can either go in through the mouth, or through the opposite orifice. In both cases, the tooth will be pulled, it's just one is relatively easy and graceful, and the other is horrible, painful, long, stinky and messy. With the forum the way it is now, I can say this and aside from some ganking in-game and getting no likes on the forums, that's all I will suffer for saying it. But under a system with ratings, I would be in deep negatives within a day for even voicing this opinion, never mind asking for changes to alleviate these problems as I see them.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1209
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 16:55:00 -
[19] - Quote
Slashdot. Yum ? http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T http://eve-search.com/stats/Akita_T T2 BPO poll : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114789 |
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
592
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:00:00 -
[20] - Quote
And at the same time somebody could be posting actual constructive posts and people like me will find the quality good but we still can't be ass'd to make a click, in which case they won't get the upvote that may help you when looking for upvote scores. So in the end you will moore than likely end up with:
Guy A - D Style: Big Alliance shiptoast Likes: 678 Dislikes: 451 Score: 227
Guy E Style Alternates from excellent to shiptoast depending on where his Bipolarity is that day Likes: 555 Dislikes: 2 Score: 553
Guy F Quality but a TL;DR creator Likes: 100 Dislikes: 40 Score 60
Guy G Style: Excellent quality, disliked by guys A-D Likes: 1400 Dislikes 1229 Score: 171
So when you decide to look for posts of quality based on a numerical factor, you will quickly find that it is extremely skewed. I think what would be better for somebody in your position is to have an ability to simply track those that you have noticed on your own accord as to being a quality poster.
Also, forum votes don't work the same as the csm election. I can log on to my 2 alts and vote somebody 3 times. But even the election proved how broken the system and how it just deduces into a popularity contest.
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Soundwave Plays Diablo
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
100
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Posted - 2012.08.08 17:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
you want a vote down button but I would vote down every post you make 12 times.
really bad idea. |
Khergit Deserters
Gallente Federation
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:05:00 -
[22] - Quote
Thor Kerrigan wrote:What I want is a system where I can search for "highest rated" posts. Could be in a single thread, in a forum section, during that specific day, best of the month, etc.
Searching for "most liked" posts would seem like a waste of time since it is restricted to "going upwards only" and very timezone-dependent. Not a bad idea. Except maybe at CSM election time. I can see a swarm of big alliance minions high-rating their leader's posts. Same could happen with recruiting threads too, maybe. |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1650
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:07:00 -
[23] - Quote
How I figure in,
Guy H Style: NPC Corp shiptoasting Likes: 1650 Dislikes 9000 Score : -7350 |
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
592
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:15:00 -
[24] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:How I figure in,
Guy H Style: NPC Corp shiptoasting Likes: 1650 Dislikes 9000 Score : -7350
YES! |
Tom Gerard
Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan
420
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:35:00 -
[25] - Quote
www.reddit.com/r/eve If you need a friend call me @ (501) 444-CCNA |
baltec1
Bat Country
1845
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:39:00 -
[26] - Quote
I will get at least -10 votes for every post simply for my alliance. Then a further -10 for my corp. And most likely -whatever for telling a miner they are stupid for thinking they didn't need a tank. |
Comingin Hot
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2012.08.08 17:54:00 -
[27] - Quote
you mean a ranking system as successful as Goon and K forum?
These guys sure are famous for high quality and rare posting, you know ... |
Praethus Tirdran
RenMax Deepspace Initiative
0
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 17:58:00 -
[28] - Quote
So this is my first post ever on these forums, and this is my first and only account. I've read many threads on these forums and have learned quite a bit and am still learning. I thought, though that i may be able to make a suggestion on this subject.
Instead of up rating or down rating the character, just uprate or down rate the individual replies.
as such a new reply would start at 0 then it could be uprated, increasing its rating above zero, or down rated decreasing its rating below zero (in which case the reply wouldnt disappear but it would colapse so as to not be seen but be able to be displayed if the reader wants to see it) or it its been rated above zero, a down rating will bring the rating closer to 0. Then the entire post could be automatically rated based on the average of the ratings of all the replies in the thread.
what do ya think? |
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
593
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 18:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
Praethus Tirdran wrote:So this is my first post ever on these forums, and this is my first and only account. I've read many threads on these forums and have learned quite a bit and am still learning. I thought, though that i may be able to make a suggestion on this subject.
Instead of up rating or down rating the character, just uprate or down rate the individual replies.
as such a new reply would start at 0 then it could be uprated, increasing its rating above zero, or down rated decreasing its rating below zero (in which case the reply wouldnt disappear but it would colapse so as to not be seen but be able to be displayed if the reader wants to see it) or it its been rated above zero, a down rating will bring the rating closer to 0. Then the entire post could be automatically rated based on the average of the ratings of all the replies in the thread.
what do ya think?
I think you will end up at the same conclusion. Posters that aren't well liked, regardless of post quality, will be collapsed regardless of the quality of the post. People who disagree with you will downvote you regardless of the quality of the post. And again it will turn into a popularity contest of who can get the most votes to stay open. Not to mention I have a condition that forces me to upsize a comment just to see why it was downsized. |
Praethus Tirdran
RenMax Deepspace Initiative
0
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 18:25:00 -
[30] - Quote
Sounded good on paper. But thats paper for you i suppose. |
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