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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 16:58:00 -
[1]
{1/2} Initially the monitor-class ship is an armored vessel with large guns and small mobility. These ships were designed to be used in coastal waters and rivers. Is science-fiction and space novels this type of ship was described as a "large armored monster with great firepower and equipped with engines, which are able to transport this vessel across the solar system".
In eve-reality this could be a Tech-2 Dreadnought.
Details and characteristics:
- No siege mode or other similar modes, does not require fuel, jump\siege skills are NOT required.
- Can NOT use gates, portals, jump bridges, wormholes.
- Warp speed is approx. 0.01 AU per second.
- Is a capital ship and can dock at stations.
- Approx. price is at range of 5-10 billion.
- "Monitors" skill required (pre-skills: Dreadnought 5 level, Capital Ships 5 level).
- 100% bonus to cap-guns damage of all kind (125% for citadel missiles).
- 100% bonus for cap-guns optimal range and citadel missiles velocity.
- "Monitors" skill bonus: -10% to cap-guns signature and -15% for explosion radius for citadel missiles per each level of skill.
- "Monitors" skill bonus: +10% amount of armor/shield repaired by armor reps/shield boosters.
- Armor\shield\structure values are equal to 225-275% of regular dreadnought ("double-doomsday" tank with regular fitting or "triple-doomsday" tank with good skills and tank-spec fitting).
- Speed\agility approx. the same as for T1 dreadnought.
- Scan Resolution = 100 (equal to battleship), targeting range is about 150km, max locked targets = 10.
- Drone Bay = 200-300 m3, bandwidth 125mbit/s, no bonuses for drone damage\hitpoints.
- Base sensors strength = 150.
- +1 high slot comparing with T1 dreadnought, also +1 med\low slot (depends on race type or amount of free slots available).
- Same amount of hardpoints for turrets\launchers as on T1 dreadnought.
So, This capital ship is more tanked then regular dreadnought, has double damage, boosted reps\shield boosters, good jamm-resistance. It uses long-range weapons, can lock targets quickly, does not have any siege\triage\whatever mode and doesnĘt have a jump-drive.
Purpose:
- Strategically - defense of important systems. It cannot leave the system it was build in.
- Tactically - annihilation of "heavy" sub-capital fleet (BS- and BC-size) from long range, assistance in destroying hostile capital ships.
And why do we really need it?
- This is a try to look at the "old-doomsday" from another angle.
This single ship that is made specifically to destroy sub-cap fleets without crazy stuff like "titan-mega-smartbomb-hell-everyone-dies". After titans were rebalanced there was a lack of simple and effective ways to counter a blob of sup-caps. Stealth-bombers that were designed by CCP to replace old doomsday now require very well-trained pilots with excellent coordination to be exactly in the right spot in the right time to perform a good attack.
- To create such-called "layered defense" in critical systems.
Nowadays there is no diversity in dealing with system-defense. No mobile bases, no orbital platforms, no minefields (tough I know that was done before). Monitors can be a first efficient device to set up and improve system-defense methods.
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 17:00:00 -
[2]
{2/2} How about benefits?
- This ship specialized on hostile sub-cap sized targets; also can nicely damage enemy capital ships.
Role- and level-bonuses allow the gang of such ships to act against BS- and BC-sized fleets while staying beyond the range of hostile guns.
- It does not require jump skill, siege-skills, and also it does not need any fuel.
Training jump skills to 4/5 level will take you same amount of time that is required to train Dreadnought & Capitals to 5 (which are required to have Monitors skill). No need to remind that these passing-by skills (dread & caps) also do not require siege\triage skills, so you can either skip them or train later.
- Tactical scalability (especially now, when "align to bookmark" is implemented).
Comparing with regular dreadnought, monitor can stay aligned when firing, and it has enough effective HP to fight off hostile tacklers or to inflict some damage to enemy' cap fleet before leaving the battlefield. Example of tactics: warping "around" the center of battlefield in bookmarked system, breaking targeting lock of long-ranged ships or avoiding bombs\fighters\fighter-bombers\warping in hostiles.
What was made during the discussion of this feature?
- Effective Hit Points were increased, bonus to armor repairer\shield booster added.
- Amount of slots was also increased. This will allow player to fit monitor specifically for the certain task.
- Sensor strength was increased.
- Limit for amount of monitors in one system now depends on the claim level.
- Warp speed is set to 0.01 AU per second to avoid usage of different gameplay exploits (e.g. farming belts on it).
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Da Trader
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Posted - 2010.10.04 19:10:00 -
[3]
A nice ship for hunting Sleepers
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 19:45:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Choh Can NOT use gates, portals, jump bridges, wormholes.
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iKill Giants
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.10.04 20:08:00 -
[5]
You can make dreadnoughts in wormholes. By reason, you should be able to produce a t2 dreadnought in one as well.
/Signed, just limit production area. ---------
People always ask me for my Rupture fit after I blow up their Abaddon. |
King Rothgar
Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2010.10.04 20:21:00 -
[6]
Cool idea, I'll support it. However at that kind of price with no ability to leave system, they need to be able to take on a comparable number of SC's and win decisively. The SC may cost 50% more, but it can move around and has other roles (logistics, transport...).
Thus far you shall read, but no further; for this is my sig. |
Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 20:47:00 -
[7]
oh
This part was lost in translation: # Number of monitor ships in system depends on system's sovereignty level: +1 ship for every level up to a maximum of 5 ships (logged off, repackaged and empty ships included). Building monitors requires sovereignty.
updated, sorry
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ghengis khan2
Corellian engineering
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Posted - 2010.10.04 21:29:00 -
[8]
hmm, this ship (from wiki description)sounds more like the old cruise wielding kessies to me... [url] |
Asuka Solo
Gallente Galactic Defence Consortium
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Posted - 2010.10.04 21:31:00 -
[9]
I love the idea + the marauder bonuses on a dread. Awesomeness. But I have a few reservations.
A capital ship without a jump drive is like a sub cap with no warp drive. useless.
I dont like the fact that its linked to sovereignty, since its going to limit the # which can be fielded (if its 1 per sov level) or limit the fielding of them at all (if a certain sov level is needed to have the ship(s) in local)
If it has the ability to engage sub capital blobs, then Que pants ****ing.
Else, 3 thumbs up.
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steave435
Caldari Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2010.10.04 21:33:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Choh oh
This part was lost in translation: # Number of monitor ships in system depends on system's sovereignty level: +1 ship for every level up to a maximum of 5 ships (logged off, repackaged and empty ships included). Building monitors requires sovereignty.
updated, sorry
So what happens when the owner loose sov?
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:08:00 -
[11]
Originally by: steave435
Originally by: Choh oh
This part was lost in translation: # Number of monitor ships in system depends on system's sovereignty level: +1 ship for every level up to a maximum of 5 ships (logged off, repackaged and empty ships included). Building monitors requires sovereignty.
updated, sorry
So what happens when the owner loose sov?
"to a maximum of 5 owner's ships" perhaps. Fine question.
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darius mclever
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:14:00 -
[12]
why would anyone put 5 ships into one system, others could just attack a different system and you couldnt bring your new t2 dreads. or you want to basically spam those ships in all important systems?
seems like a big waste imho ... especially when you aim for 5-10bn
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Valarre
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:23:00 -
[13]
5-10 billion is a lot. Darius I can see how the dreads would be useful. Are you really that closed minded and stupid to see the use for them?
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Valarre
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:36:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Valarre on 04/10/2010 22:36:44
Originally by: darius mclever why would anyone put 5 ships into one system, others could just attack a different system and you couldnt bring your new t2 dreads. or you want to basically spam those ships in all important systems?
seems like a big waste imho ... especially when you aim for 5-10bn
This is what you are. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh33bGAxl58
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:38:00 -
[15]
Tech 2 & marauder\etc bonuses vs cannot leave the system. 5-10b is a lot? I do not think so. Perhaps.
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Dariix
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:39:00 -
[16]
Nice idea... but what about all the small people. The way it stands now it's hard enough for a non sov holding alliance to gain a foothold... This sounds as though it would even further this. I like the idea of limiting to the # in system... but don't like the idea of this being based on sov... or giving the defender yet another advantage.
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Valarre
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Posted - 2010.10.04 22:40:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Choh Tech 2 & marauder\etc bonuses vs cannot leave the system. 5-10b is a lot? I do not think so. Perhaps.
It is a bit much. I probably would rather see them give us the ability to have a pos/battlestation sit at a gate with gate guns, warp disrupters, and ecms. That to me seems more reasonable, however I still entertain your idea.
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Typhado3
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.10.05 02:06:00 -
[18]
I like the idea of a system ship.
However I'd remove the 5 number limit, too vulnerable to exploitation. Take one and log off forever leaving you stuck at 4 max in that system. Or if only limited to owner switch owner of system build 5 switch again another 5 etc.
You could implement this by having it linked to the iHub or role bonuses. Say you can have as many as you want but only '5' (upgrades to iHub determine number) can recieve role bonuses at a time. So it's not impossible to have more than 5 but fielding more than 5 is a bit of a waste.
Had a similar idea a while ago but mine was a regular (cruiser/frig sized) ship that couldn't use stargates and had no warp drives. Instead it would be carried to the battle by another ship then launched. One of the ideas that I added to that was that for in system warping they could follow the ship that carried them there in warp, same as a fleet warp. Maybe to help this ship you could have a 'tug boat' like ship so if needed they could warp to a battle quickly at a cost, opening up warp tunnel for these ships would cost similar to a cyno. ------------------------------ God is an afk cloaker |
darius mclever
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Posted - 2010.10.05 04:44:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Valarre 5-10 billion is a lot. Darius I can see how the dreads would be useful. Are you really that closed minded and stupid to see the use for them?
lol. you think that is a lot for big alliances? I could persoanlly by 1 every 3months. and thats just my personal income. you will never ever balance anything with cost/price in this game.
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Valarre
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Posted - 2010.10.05 05:28:00 -
[20]
Originally by: darius mclever
Originally by: Valarre 5-10 billion is a lot. Darius I can see how the dreads would be useful. Are you really that closed minded and stupid to see the use for them?
lol. you think that is a lot for big alliances? I could persoanlly by 1 every 3months. and thats just my personal income. you will never ever balance anything with cost/price in this game.
LOL hey dilusional mclever I was just saying that price would be a little high for t2 dreadnaughts. Not that it still wouldn't be affordable to big alliances. I'm sure you can buy one every 3 months, after all you live in your mom's basement which allows you to save the money you make at burger king. I could buy one today, and if I lose it I could buy more plexes and buy one. Big whoop, am I supposed to be impressed by how much isk you have? People in this game has isk by the 100's of billions, if not possibly trillions. We got big spender here Dilusional Mclever! He can spend 5 BIIIIILLION isks!!! Give him a round of applause!
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.05 06:19:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Typhado3 Take one and log off forever leaving you stuck at 4 max in that system. Or if only limited to owner switch owner of system build 5 switch again another 5 etc.
Kick this capsuleer, abandoned ship as result. And scan system.
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Stormesses
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Posted - 2010.10.05 09:10:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Stormesses on 05/10/2010 09:12:31 Edited by: Stormesses on 05/10/2010 09:11:08 Do not want. They'll be just big shiny targets. Let dev's fix lags first.
End of tread.
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.05 15:44:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Stormesses Do not want. End of tread.
from eve-ru.com with love, obviously.
More questions\comments?
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Angel Guardian
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Posted - 2010.10.05 17:47:00 -
[24]
my 2Cents
Link the ship to the out/post station owner in Sys. by the building of a destructable service. The ships them selves might atuly cost considerbly less however once a batch is produiced they have a limited lifespan (say 7 days) and stay in space even when logged off. They can dock but the ship is subject to inpoundment by the station owner when docked. In other words its a very hardy and tough ship but its application is limited to defence.
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.23 09:53:00 -
[25]
So the topic has sinked, there is no point in bumping it anymore.
Is there any chance to see commentaries from CCP devs? Is there any point in wasting my time and in working on ideas before posting them?
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bartos100
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Posted - 2010.12.23 11:07:00 -
[26]
i like the idea of a capital ship without a jumpdrive but i think you should be able to "package" it
breaking it down in several different parts and then moving it with haulers to a new system and put it back together in a staging POS in enemy space
would make it hard to move but give good firepower to lay wast to enemy support fleets
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Choh
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.27 04:37:00 -
[27]
simply up..
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Space Pinata
Amarr Discount Napkin Industries
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Posted - 2010.12.27 08:28:00 -
[28]
Why should there be an easy counter to a large number of enemy ships?
How is this anything except a fantasy of "man, I really want to be super hardcore and fight whole fleets by myself"?
You sound like a cap pilot who got into a capship and realized they just fill roles and aren't winbuttons, and you very much want to fly a winbutton.
Not supported, no, never. Who on earth thinks this is a good idea? |
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