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TgrFox5
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Posted - 2010.03.02 22:45:00 -
[1]
I always hear people saying that active tanks are better when your solo and passive when your in a fleet. Why exactly is this? I can't help but think that passive would work just as well if not better solo, can someone enlighten me on this point. Thanks
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James Tritanius
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Posted - 2010.03.02 22:48:00 -
[2]
Target selection.
While you are running solo, you will be more likely to engage other solo players and small gangs. In those situations, active tanks can usually counter most of their DPS to be more effective than buffer tanks.
In gang situations, your gang will engage larger opposing forces. Thus, your active tank will not counter enough DPS to be more effective than buffer tanks.
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Ka Jolo
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2010.03.02 23:07:00 -
[3]
Originally by: TgrFox5 Why exactly is this? I can't help but think that passive would work just as well if not better solo, can someone enlighten me on this point. Thanks
Your correct that either method would work just as well for solo purposes. Actually, the issue is usually between active/passive and buffer. Being able to actively repair 500 DPS, being able to passively repair 500 DPS, or being able to absorb, say, 20K EHP for a cruiser would all be viable solutions for solo work. 1 on 1, it is less likely you'll be neuted. Given that, many people prefer the active/passive tank, as it allows them to cheaply and conveniently repair their ships during and after each battle.
In a gang, however, the combined DPS of several ships could overwhelm your ability to repair. If your repairers can handle 500 DPS, but you're taking 2K DPS, you'll be dead by the time your repairers try to activate for the third or maybe even the second cycle. In that case, a buffer of 20K EHP on a cruiser lets you live longer (and thus be of more use to your own gang).
Jolo
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Equus
Nemesis Nation
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Posted - 2010.03.02 23:47:00 -
[4]
I also believe fitting for an active (fitting resists over say a shield extender) is more beneficial when you have logistics in your gang to rep you. ... |
Kael'ah
Minmatar Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2010.03.03 01:15:00 -
[5]
In fleets you get so much damage thrown at you that a local rep simply won't have the time to be useful. In situations like that you want buffer, that way you might last a few seconds more, possibly to get RRed.
In solo situations a local rep can be good but most of the times it isn't due to cap issues, repair amount, lack of EHP because of active tank and whatnot. A proper sized plate/shield extender makes up for about 45ish seconds of repping, so if the fight lasts less than 45 seconds you're already in trouble with an active rep but in the mean time you're losing massive cap because of the repping and you have to manage it. It's much easier/lazier to simply have a big amount of EHP and not have to manage/worry about it.
Local repping starts to work when the ship has bonuses to it and when you start to use "tricks" to increase the tanking like implants, boosters and possibly gang links. Then you can get an active tanked ship to silly values, far far beyond what's normal (not very difficult to have a std T2 fit Maelstrom tank 2600 omni) so if you end up in a somewhat even fight you can simply go "my tank is better than yours" and win that way. Same for a Cyclone, albeit at lower numbers obviously.
So active tanks work if your repping comes close enough to (or surpasses) your target's damage output or if you disengage/kite a lot, lowering their damage so you can wait a few seconds to get your HP back up and attack again, their HP will still be at the same point.
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Tornado Bait
Minmatar Hellhounds. HellFleet
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Posted - 2010.03.03 02:36:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Tornado Bait on 03/03/2010 02:36:12 thanks for the replies, one of my favorite ships is the x-large boost cyclone and i try to take that solo against small gangs unfortunately i often get "pilgrim'd". Kiting i can see why would be beneficial for an active tank however thats something i need to practice cause i always get tackled
Also i know i said passive, but i really meant buffer.
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viper09
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Posted - 2010.03.03 04:34:00 -
[7]
if u want a laugh when solo fit a myrm with 3 reps and take blue pills u can happily tank 3 bs while ur drones **** them up but u need bc 5 for it to be most efffective ps u will nee dual cap booster 800s highs try use acs to dish out a bit more dps
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Insa Rexion
Minmatar Fumar Puede Matar
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Posted - 2010.03.03 07:31:00 -
[8]
Originally by: viper09 if u want a laugh when solo fit a myrm with 3 reps and take blue pills u can happily tank 3 bs while ur drones **** them up but u need bc 5 for it to be most efffective ps u will nee dual cap booster 800s highs try use acs to dish out a bit more dps
I would laugh at anyone who took blue pills while piloting a tri rep myrm --------------------------------------------
well mannered ****ole |
Darthewok
Perkone
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Posted - 2010.03.03 08:36:00 -
[9]
search the video index for solo cyclone videos. there are many. basically active tank is useful for only a handful of ships solo. eg cyclone, myrm, domi, hyperion, sacrilege, ishtar, maybe brutix etc. there are plenty of ships that are better suited for buffer or even passive tank (drake) solo. the advantage of active tank for solo for the ships that are suited for it is that they can last much longer in fights than buffer can as long as cap charges last. if you fly active tank you need cap boosters and maybe nos though.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.03.03 09:07:00 -
[10]
Quote:
(not very difficult to have a std T2 fit Maelstrom tank 2600 omni)
Do you have an example of such fitting? - Auditing and consulting
Before asking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h and http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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Kittel
Caldari Black Rise Angels Dead Reckoning Alliance
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Posted - 2010.03.03 09:31:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Kittel on 03/03/2010 09:36:21
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:
(not very difficult to have a std T2 fit Maelstrom tank 2600 omni)
Do you have an example of such fitting?
With Min BS5 and crystals you would prob get close to this without an a,b, or X type x-L Booster
Without calculating/eft'ing, i'ld say mael with full crystals and 2 T2 amps would get 2k or so. With a, b or x go into the range listed above maybe even more.
edit, with L5 BS, 2 amps and x-l all t2 = 1500, b type = 1800, xtype = 2100 with above and low grade crystals = 2000, b type = 2400, xtype = 2800 with above and high grade crystals = 2300, b type = 2700, xtype = 3200
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King Rothgar
Violent By Design
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Posted - 2010.03.03 11:34:00 -
[12]
Both work for solo or small gang. I typically favor a hybrid tank. It doesn't have the full EHP of a regular buffer tank nor does it have the active repair capability of a full active tank. But it has a good balance of the two. My setups are mostly buffer but with enough active repair to negate maybe 25-50% of incoming dps and the ability to fully rep after the fight. It's simple, effective and very cheap. In any case, all three setups are viable for solo. -----------------------------------------------------
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Marko Riva
Adamant Inc.
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Posted - 2010.03.03 15:36:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Marko Riva on 03/03/2010 15:42:34
Originally by: Kittel Edited by: Kittel on 03/03/2010 09:36:21
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:
(not very difficult to have a std T2 fit Maelstrom tank 2600 omni)
Do you have an example of such fitting?
With Min BS5 and crystals you would prob get close to this without an a,b, or X type x-L Booster
Without calculating/eft'ing, i'ld say mael with full crystals and 2 T2 amps would get 2k or so. With a, b or x go into the range listed above maybe even more.
edit, with L5 BS, 2 amps and x-l all t2 = 1500, b type = 1800, xtype = 2100 with above and low grade crystals = 2000, b type = 2400, xtype = 2800 with above and high grade crystals = 2300, b type = 2700, xtype = 3200
Don't forget gang links and blue pills :)
Here's my fit which uses a CN XL but tanks more, so I "converted" that back to somewhat less tanking with T2 only but there's a few cpu issues then, can be worked out ofc.
----------- I think, therefore I'm single. Want to learn combat/PVP? Alliance creation service |
Emily Poast
The Whipping Post
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Posted - 2010.03.03 15:56:00 -
[14]
Yeah I have seen a lot of hybrid tanks lately, and have used them myself. I think they are a pretty good compromise.
Commom hybrid tank fits you will see (I am gallente, so that is what I will list):
Rifter/Tristan - 200 plate + SAR II Vexor - 1600 plate + MAR II + small ACs (probably my favorite disposable pvp ship setup). Thorax - 1600 plate + SAR II Brutix - 800 plate + 2x MAR II (needs an ACR rig or two, I forget) Myrm - 800 or 1600 plate + 2x MAR II (depends on what guns you want to fit - also needs at least one ACR rig) Mega - 2 x 1600 plate + LAR II (this one is featured in a number of videos. Kil2 and KaiH I think - search for Club Bear guys).
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TgrFox5
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Posted - 2010.03.03 18:12:00 -
[15]
Edited by: TgrFox5 on 03/03/2010 18:15:47 Yes i've also seen the hybrid tanks often in pvp videos but only on armor tanking ships, never shield.
thanks for the link to the video index, i knew people had videos but that index is super handy
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Borgh Brainbasher
Path of Now and Forever
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Posted - 2010.03.03 20:24:00 -
[16]
I actually prefer a hybrid tank on my large battle mealstrom. That way you are not totaly dependant on cap and lag for your tank and you get some use out of the shield boosting bonus. --- Warning: You are on the pvp only server. |
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