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Ran Khanon
Amarr Vengeance Innovations
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Posted - 2010.01.23 21:31:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Meylota LeFey 9 Assault Frigates can take out a (failfit) Rorq.
Writeup
Killboard
Nice write up :) +1
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Verx Interis
Amarr Selectus Pravus Lupus
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Posted - 2010.01.23 21:55:00 -
[62]
hi i m ruhtrd i wnt to solo capital in subcap DDDUUUURRRRRRRHURRRRRURRRRRDDUURRRP ---- Logins required for this post: 551392 |
Dacryphile
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Posted - 2010.01.24 00:10:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Slade Hoo posting in a "i can't solo a cap ship in a cruiser"-thread
Fixed it for ya.
Originally by: Doc Robertson ...take a good look at this pic and tell us which one is you.
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Stygian Knight
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:16:00 -
[64]
Props to Rorq pilot to have balls to be in the belt. usually 1 vaga in system = more to come.
Rorq is a 0.0 ship and that pilot did his role.
And for OP, you were suppose to put the point, kill the drones and yell on vent for backup. Eve is muliplayer game... wait multiplayer
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Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:18:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Vikarion
Seriously, for a ship more expensive than a carrier, it should be tanking more than it does.
Since when is price any indication for performance?
By your logic for example a vindicator should tank more than a carrier, as well as should marauders. I dont think I need to tell you how silly that would be.
Seriously, people need to get that stupid price = performance idea out of their heads.
On the subject, in some way the OP got a point, the rorqual got too much in terms of damage output / combat ability and too little in terms of being a useful mining support ship. But opinions might vary on that.
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Amarrian Cynicism
Amarr Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:27:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington Awwww look at the poor widdle Vaga pilot, crying his eyes out because he couldn't solo a capship in it.
This, really.
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Kassa Daito
Capital Construction Research
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:28:00 -
[67]
Edited by: Kassa Daito on 24/01/2010 04:31:51
Originally by: Axemaster Based on this, I would have to resort to bringing in a DREAD to kill a mining ship! Forget using a gank fit battleship, you simply can't kill him. On top of having 200km base lock range and a fast lock speed, and an absurdly high sensor strength (this is a mining ship for god's sake). And finally, the indignity of the rorq being able to protect every ship around it with heavily bonused capital reps.
So I'm forced to ask, what exactly is the role of this ship? To me, it looks like a carrier without fighters. I can accept not being able to kill it with a gank HAC, but if even a battleship doesn't stand a chance, isn't it possible that this mining ship is a bit overpowered?
NOTE: This post is not a whine. I'm genuinely confused about what CCP could have intended with this ship. It just feels very weird to me that a HAC can't even scratch the paint on what is, ultimately, a mining ship.
In case you're still reading, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt ans say this actually isn't a whine and not give you too hard a time for coming to the forums to ask why you can't solo a cap ship.
Simply put: you're too used to dealing with the crappily designed and even worse fitted subcapital industrial ships. Industrial ships in this game are commonly misinterpreted as free killmails and miscategorized the Rorqual as Industrial instead of the support ship it actually is.
The rorqual is NOT an industrial ship. It is a fleet support capital ship, much like a carrier. While the carrier receives bonuses intended to support combat fleets, the Rorqual receives bonuses intended to support mining fleets. It NEEDS that fast lock speed to target a >100m ship that can be alphaed by a small BS fleet before 1-2 roamers can kill it. It NEEDS that cap RR to keep a ship with practically no tank alive under sustained fire. It NEEDS that >2k DPS tank because it can be hit for full damage by a **** dread.
If you want to kill a rorqual solo then bring the same ship you'd bring to kill EVE's *other* fleet support ship: a carrier (bring a Titan).
In a semi-related topic: IMO, EVERY *indistrial ship* (this excludes the Rorqual because it is not an industrial ship) should be able to sacrifice its indy-value increasing mods (cargo expanders and/or mining laser upgrades) and tank to match hulls near its SP/ISK cost. A Covetor should be able to tank like a T1 combat cruiser or BC (but not do DPS), a Hulk should tank like a T1 BS or HAC (adjusted for sig radius, of course), a T1 indy should tank like a cruiser (although it should still turn like a brick). Industrial ships, especially the T2 variants should be well-protected as any intelligent person would design them for such hostile areas. Back before the barges and exhumers, you occasionally saw BSes out there in nullsec mining with double rep systems that could be just as tough to crack open as an overtanked Dominix, though with less DPS capacity.
That's not to give them any kind of real combat ability but instead, the ability to survive until a combat fleet within a very short range can make it in to support them. As-is, even a combat fleet in the belt with them can't stop a small group from killing several hulks and warping off. ** Disclaimer: Author sometimes spell checks but is not responsible for sins of commission, omission, emission, transmission, or submission. Flowers, bricks, or any other form of feedback appreciated |
Axemaster
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:35:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Burnharder Great thread. Hilarious troll OP. I assume this is a joke, right?
Looking at ^ ...
I'd say this is successful troll. Lawl.
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Denidil
Gallente The Graduates Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:39:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Final Director Yes I know it's a capital ship, but it very clearly isn't designed as a combat ship. So I take issue with the neccessity of bringing in 10+ pilots (considering a high speed roam) just to kill the thing.
its still a capital ship. 2k rep is low end of capitals
yes it is an industrial ship
but it is a CAPITAL INDUSTRIAL SHIP.
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Electric Potential
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Posted - 2010.01.24 06:09:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Omara Otawan
Originally by: Vikarion
Seriously, for a ship more expensive than a carrier, it should be tanking more than it does.
Since when is price any indication for performance?
By your logic for example a vindicator should tank more than a carrier, as well as should marauders. I dont think I need to tell you how silly that would be.
A Vindicator can put out more DPS than a carrier, though.
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Dabljuh
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Posted - 2010.01.24 15:06:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Dabljuh on 24/01/2010 15:06:27 Why did the Vaga get away again? I mean, no point and stuff - but why doesn't a vaga pilot ever have to pay for his incompetence?
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Hiroshima Jita
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Posted - 2010.01.24 15:14:00 -
[72]
Originally by: FireT Just curious but since when have people become so actively whinny? Carebears get ganked and whine. Missionrunners get stolen from and whine. Now gankers actually whine?
What happened to 'The world doesn't revolve around an individual and just accept that not everything goes your way?
My favorite is the people who whine about people whining. And then of course there are the people who whine about people who whine about people whining...
Rorquals are designed as combat capable ships to some degree or another. Its not a good idea to field them normally because the chance of someone opening a cyno and having an instapoping titan come through is not particularly low. There are many other varients of this event. Most of the time rorquals get to live in a pos somewhere munching the ore haulers bring to them and handing out gang bonuses.
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Grimpak
Gallente Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2010.01.24 17:26:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Dabljuh Edited by: Dabljuh on 24/01/2010 15:06:27 Why did the Vaga get away again? I mean, no point and stuff - but why doesn't a vaga pilot ever have to pay for his incompetence?
ever heard of karma?
don't worry, it'll bite, sooner or later ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Vherr Arkhar
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Posted - 2010.01.24 17:42:00 -
[74]
I read perma, look at pvp fits, notice something... is that... no it couldnt be... a ... NEUT?
gosh darnit. If you want to kill a 2 billion isk ship put some effort in it.
Congrats to the mining people who actually did something that you always hear when some miner whines about getting ganked: They fought back. They invested isk to increase their chance of not getting killed by a single freckin ship!
I don't know IF you are thinking this far but maybe... just maybe...
3 vs 1 in ships worth 100 times what you field should have a decent chance of at least surviving. *sigh*
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Annowyn
Majestic Disturbance
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Posted - 2010.01.24 17:46:00 -
[75]
Not reading past the 1st 2 or 3 posts.
But I am sure it has been said. It is a cap ship.
I mean, did you not know this?
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Alenora Tizar
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Posted - 2010.01.24 19:09:00 -
[76]
makes me want to go pvp in a rorqual :)
seriously though, it did exactly what its supposed to do
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VicturusTeSaluto
Metafarmers MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2010.01.24 22:33:00 -
[77]
That's what you get for not fitting a cyno
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Kitsune Girl
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Posted - 2010.01.24 22:54:00 -
[78]
This is what I love about the Rorqual. A a friend of mine lives in 0.0 space and he tells me that the Rorqual is a very powerful weapon. Not only can it provide bonuses and protect its mining fleet, it can cyno jump on its own, can house clones, and can compress the ores that it carries.
The downside is its industrial core module. Once activated, it can't move for the next 10 minutes. Hell, it can't even turn on the spot while the module is active. But of course, a Rorqual will already know better than to use the module in an asteroid belt. Every Rorqual in 0.0 will only activate the module while INSIDE a POS shield. If there is no POS in the system, the Rorqual will not be alone in terms of defense.
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Kitsune Girl
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Posted - 2010.01.24 23:00:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Ran Khanon
Originally by: Meylota LeFey 9 Assault Frigates can take out a (failfit) Rorq.
Writeup
Killboard
Nice write up :) +1
Oh my God! Are you kidding me?
No defenses? Not even a shield booster nor drones? My God, that is a terrible fit.
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Psychotic Maniac
Caldari Head Shrinkers
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Posted - 2010.01.25 01:09:00 -
[80]
STUPID TROLL GO AWAY
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BraveLttl Toaster
Intergalactic Hunters of ManBearPig
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Posted - 2010.01.25 01:41:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Axemaster "10 men gang and no one neuting ?"
In my experience high speed assualt frig / HAC gangs usually don't have much in the way of neuts. Maybe a curse would help, but it'll still take a long time to cap out.
Are you f***ing kidding me, every one of those assault frigs and HAC's should be packing a nuet.... Especially that cherished vaga of yours....
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Culmen
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.01.25 04:16:00 -
[82]
Just a thought
[Rorqual, bane of pirates] Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II
Capital Shield Booster I Shield Boost Amplifier II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Photon Scattering Field II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II
First its already commiting a mortal carebear sin and filling it's low slots with cap power relays and not cargo expanders (obviously has no carebear honor)
Second, it perma tanks 2200+ dps, but this assumes its only tankinging and not using remote reps or neuts.
Three, two competitantly pilot curses can get its tank down to less then 500 dps. Those two curses alone will kill it, assuming they had a enough time and cap boosters. If the rorq keeps boosting, the curses will suck it dry in 5 minutes flat.
Every additional ship after that just makes it faster
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
BraveLttl Toaster
Intergalactic Hunters of ManBearPig
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Posted - 2010.01.25 04:55:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Culmen Just a thought
[Rorqual, bane of pirates] Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II
Capital Shield Booster I Shield Boost Amplifier II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Photon Scattering Field II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II
First its already commiting a mortal carebear sin and filling it's low slots with cap power relays and not cargo expanders (obviously has no carebear honor)
Second, it perma tanks 2200+ dps, but this assumes its only tankinging and not using remote reps or neuts.
Three, two competitantly pilot curses can get its tank down to less then 500 dps. Those two curses alone will kill it, assuming they had a enough time and cap boosters. If the rorq keeps boosting, the curses will suck it dry in 5 minutes flat.
Every additional ship after that just makes it faster
Two things 1) Cap power relays are a big 'no no' as far as active shield tanks are concerned 2) The real bane of would be attackers are heavy nuets
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Cambarus
The Compass Reloaded
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Posted - 2010.01.25 06:12:00 -
[84]
Originally by: BraveLttl Toaster
Originally by: Culmen
Two things 1) Cap power relays are a big 'no no' as far as active shield tanks are concerned 2) The real bane of would be attackers are heavy nuets
Two things 1) If you think cap power relays are a big 'no no' for shield tankers then you know very little about capital shield tanks. That being said with only 3 lows in which to put them the benefit here is iffy. (For those interested the reason behind this is that the shield penalty on CPRs is stacking-nerfed but the cap bonus is not, one SBA pretty much counters the effects of a full rack of CPRs, and, on carriers at least, this results in a slight drop in max tank in exchange for an absolutely ridiculous amount of capacitor and sustainable tank.)
2) I do hope you're referring to the heavy neuts that should be on that rorqual, because if you're referring to the neuts on the curses... I'm not even gonna comment on that :P |
Weeka
GET A JOB
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Posted - 2010.01.25 06:14:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Culmen Capacitor Power Relay II ... Capital Shield Booster I
--- Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels. Zymurgist |
Hellfury Resurrected
Incura
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Posted - 2010.01.25 06:34:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Weeka
Originally by: Culmen Capacitor Power Relay II ... Capital Shield Booster I
WTS: clue -------------------------------------------
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Shaitis
Caldari Reikoku IT Alliance
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Posted - 2010.01.25 07:21:00 -
[87]
I didnt read all, but next time I recommend to take a cyno and drop him dread, you will understand than what is purpose of capitals.
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Grimpak
Gallente Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2010.01.25 10:30:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Cambarus 1) If you think cap power relays are a big 'no no' for shield tankers then you know very little about capital shield tanks. That being said with only 3 lows in which to put them the benefit here is iffy. (For those interested the reason behind this is that the shield penalty on CPRs is stacking-nerfed but the cap bonus is not, one SBA pretty much counters the effects of a full rack of CPRs, and, on carriers at least, this results in a slight drop in max tank in exchange for an absolutely ridiculous amount of capacitor and sustainable tank.)
this is true for capships only.
don't try to do it on subcapships, unless you want a pr0-fit lossmail. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Xtover
Suicide Kings
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Posted - 2010.01.25 13:02:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Hellfury Resurrected
Originally by: Weeka
Originally by: Culmen Capacitor Power Relay II ... Capital Shield Booster I
WTS: clue
he must have those super rare capital SB II's
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Sumelar
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Posted - 2010.01.25 14:06:00 -
[90]
Originally by: TimMc
I have no problem with it being able to tank, but combat shouldn't be a mining ships thing.
It's not a mining ship, you don't fit lasers on a rorq. It's a capital ship designed to support mining operations. Defense certainly falls under the support category, and killing people attacking you is part of defense.
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