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Lt George
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Posted - 2009.05.14 02:41:00 -
[1]
Hi everybody, if like me you've been playing eve for more than a week then you probably would have realized that Jita's, amongst other systems' local chat is constantly being spammed with scams. It has always been like that and there has never been a real solution to the problem.
I would like to suggest that perhaps a refund system be made available where-by the scamee would be able to have their isk returned within a set time period of time if, for whatever reason, they are not fully satisfied with their purchase.
If people who were scammed were able to obtain a refund once they'd realized they'd overpaid by, what is usually a ridiculous sum, then it would make scamming via contract spamming pointless and therefore obsolete.
Of course there are many other factors to consider which admittedly I have not done yet, but thats just the idea I had and would love to hear some feedback on it. Lt George
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Evthron Macyntire
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Posted - 2009.05.14 02:46:00 -
[2]
The potential for griefing is off the scale. ------------------------------ Sigs like this. |
Zynce
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Posted - 2009.05.14 03:03:00 -
[3]
How about we just promote literacy in general? 99% of all the scams I've seen rely on exploiting a persons greed coupled with them simply not actually reading what they're agreeing to. |
Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc
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Posted - 2009.05.14 03:30:00 -
[4]
Next time George, read your contract before you click accept and then run off to MD to cry
Blueprint Store |
EVEHelpisSeriousBusiness
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Posted - 2009.05.14 03:42:00 -
[5]
step 1: fly to jita
step 2: read contracts **** step 2 step 3: click accept step 4: alt-tab and whine
did I miss anything?
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Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc
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Posted - 2009.05.14 03:59:00 -
[6]
Originally by: EVEHel****eriousBusiness step 1: fly to jita
step 2: read contracts **** step 2 step 3: click accept step 4: alt-tab and whine step 5: annoy others
did I miss anything?
Fixed
Blueprint Store |
Lord Windu
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.05.14 04:19:00 -
[7]
Wow, I came to Market discussion to troll some threads, but this is just too easy, so easy in fact I have lost the will to troll. I would hate you if I could care.
~ ☺ A Kirra Liu Presentation. Will give cyber for GTC ☺ |
Rudy Gnarl
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Posted - 2009.05.14 04:42:00 -
[8]
I think that if there was some way to keep the links to contracts out of the local that might help. I think it is a bit of a shame that the local in Jita and other busy systems is completely useless. I just don't even look at it. But it would be nice if there was some purpose for it other than scamming.
Now on the contracts, I have to agree with most of the posters here . . . read the contract and in general just don't even look to local channels for good contracts. Use the contract search app in the game and do some research.
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PublicRelations Kwint
Lothian Quay Industries
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Posted - 2009.05.14 04:55:00 -
[9]
Congratulations George, you are the low hanging fruit.
Purchasing and Shipping Moon Minerals |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2009.05.14 12:27:00 -
[10]
Originally by: PublicRelations Kwint Congratulations George, you are the low hanging fruit.
Rotten at that |
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FreddyMac
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Posted - 2009.05.14 13:31:00 -
[11]
George....incase you didnt know.....scamming is perfectly legal in EVE. Its meant to be there and is working as intended.
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Zezzix
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Posted - 2009.05.14 13:59:00 -
[12]
CAVEAT EMPTOR |
Packtu'sa
Nabaal Construction and Industrials Corp
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Posted - 2009.05.14 14:00:00 -
[13]
Originally by: FreddyMac George....incase you didnt know.....scamming is perfectly legal in EVE. Its meant to be there and is working as intended.
Yeah, it's just local chat that doesn't work anymore.
Packtu'sa Founder/CEO, Nabaal Construction and Industrials Corp [NCIC] |
Feronia
Gallente Magma Industries
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Posted - 2009.05.14 14:08:00 -
[14]
The first thing I do when entering Jita is close local chat.
But anyway, today's patch will greatly reduce the number of people who fall for those scams. And hopefully also the contract spam.
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Ta'jek
Angels Of Death EVE Free Worlds Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.14 14:44:00 -
[15]
the lazy scammers are boring... I can appreciate the ones that take work and effort, like the one before my time(sorry forget the name) when they infiltrated the corp, stole all the assests and lured the CEO out in the shiny BS to be taken out... or the guy "borrowing" freighters in Jita...
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Flying ZombieJesus
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Posted - 2009.05.14 14:48:00 -
[16]
FURTHERMORE I WOULD LIKE CONCORD TO ESCORT ME WHEREVER I GO SO PEOPLE CANT STEAL MY STUFF
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Caleb Ayrania
Gallente TarNec Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll
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Posted - 2009.05.15 03:17:00 -
[17]
If this was a Gauntlet the guy would already be dead..
George! Brush it off, and start training your forum tanking skills..
- Money is Love - Sometimes it just gets bend the wrong ways.
Feed your Brain:
Innovation Thread |
Lt George
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Posted - 2009.05.28 11:06:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Brock Nelson Next time George, read your contract before you click accept and then run off to MD to cry
Actually I've never fallen for a scam, you seem to think that falling for scams is the only problem assosiated with scamming but actually there are more than that...would you like me to list them for you?
Originally by: EVEHel****eriousBusiness step 1: fly to jita
step 2: read contracts **** step 2 step 3: click accept step 4: alt-tab and whine
did I miss anything?
No you didn't but you did assume something, and that is that i have been scammed.
Tbh honest i was actually expecting to get alot of negative feedback especially since so many people in the game benefit from or even rely on scamming. Also It's good to see so many people have alot of highly opinionated insults but very few contructive suggestions.
Those who quip that the solution is as simple as closing local or not reading local, just reading the contracts etc I ask - if the solution is so simple then why does scamming remain a problem?
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Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2009.05.28 11:21:00 -
[19]
I hate scam, I'm getting sick of looking into populated locals whose purpose is only spam and scam, I appreciate ANY anti-spam/scam measure:
- excluding trials from locals - contract linking only in private chats, but I think the spammers would just keep spamming unlinked - refunding contracts in a short period of time, say 1h(no abuse possible, both get their stuff back)
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Syndoral
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Posted - 2009.05.28 11:24:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Syndoral on 28/05/2009 11:24:36 It's a problem because people don't read before they get scammed. They can read the contract, they can read the forums, take your pick.
Or they just have more isk than sense, and deserve to have the isk burden taken from their shoulders.
There are two things that are infinite: The universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the first one.
The contract system has no need of fixing. The scammed have need of learning.
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MacMasters
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Posted - 2009.05.28 12:13:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Lt George It has always been like that and there has never been a real solution to the problem
2 part: 1) hasn't ALWAYS been like that, and if it has then whats the problem? you know thats how it is and should look at contracts advertised there as such 2) solution to "problem": literacy and comprehension of english
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Something Awry
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Posted - 2009.05.28 15:42:00 -
[22]
If you're too stupid to fly through Jita without being scammed, you're too stupid to play Eve.
Here's a genuine idea though - an Eve TV version of BBC3's The Real Hustle. No, it would be too easy.
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Tom Peeping
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Posted - 2009.05.28 17:54:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Lt George
Tbh honest i was actually expecting to get alot of negative feedback especially since so many people in the game benefit from or even rely on scamming. Also It's good to see so many people have alot of highly opinionated insults but very few contructive suggestions.
Those who quip that the solution is as simple as closing local or not reading local, just reading the contracts etc I ask - if the solution is so simple then why does scamming remain a problem?
A. Scamming doesn't remain a problem. Working as intended. That is the only constructive criticism and you've gotten it lots of times.
Constructive criticism doesn't not mean that we have to agree with you, or in some way "constructively" modify your suggestion. There has to be a simple I disagree option available. That doesn't count as flaming or being stupid.
B. I'm glad you expected negative feedback. It's only expected when you post an idea that is counter to a long accepted game mechanic that CCP has specifically endorsed as appropriate gameplay.
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Jarvis Hellstrom
Gallente The Flying Tigers
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Posted - 2009.05.28 18:59:00 -
[24]
Personally I find scams boring, stupid and annoying and, while CCP may think that they're okay, I actually happen to think that they're shooting themselves in the foot.
Scams seem to mostly impact newbies. They're the ones who haven't been around long enough to pick up on the tricks of contract scamming etc. Anyone who reads the contract CAREFULLY will realize what's up, but new folks aren't really up on that yet. The contract system can be a little (or a lot) intimidating to newbies. Certainly I found it so long ago and I've written and negotiated real world contracts!
The reason I feel that CCP may be going the wrong way in allowing scamming is that, honestly, if someone gets taken badly enough and early enough that's a lost account, a lost customer and a bunch of other potential customers that may never play EVE. In short, it's bad business. Particularly when it's something like someone altering a decimal on a contract as that's not so much a matter of not 'reading' as the font being hard to read and the change small and easy to miss. Contracts are about consent and one cannot consent when one is lied to (essentially) about what the price really is by relying on a system weakness to confuse them.
One way to fix it might be to make some kinds of contracts only available to those in player corps (ie: make the War Dec-able). Getting back at someone for a flawed contract is probably one of the most correct 'in-game' reasons for a corporate war that I can imagine particularly in the absence of litigation such as we use in the real world.
I don't think I've ever been scammed, but I did once have a lot of fun with a scammer running the old "You can't dock at the destination station" courier scam. See, I knew the destination station was blue. While, as it turned out, I couldn't dock with it, I was on good enough terms with the owning Alliance that the diplo gave me docking permission for a few minutes so I could complete the contract. Now the scammer's worthless junk is at a station he cannot get to and their ISK went into my wallet.
Point to Hellstrom.
May God stand between you and harm in all the Empty places you must walk
(Old Egyptian Blessing) |
Monstah Khaos
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Posted - 2009.05.28 19:15:00 -
[25]
Lol... how about a rating system like EBay? Heheh. When you realize you just paid 100 million ISK for an invuln field2 you can get mad and give them a BIG -10 rating!!! If the scammer has enough "bad" ratings from contracts built up, it will give you a BIG RED FLASHY in the contract details.
Joking of course
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Jade Mitch
The Scope
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Posted - 2009.05.28 20:18:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Jade Mitch on 28/05/2009 20:21:52
Most of the people who get scammed are old and blind, or near blind, and they don't always catch ever detail especially when Eve's market interface is so visually confusing and unintuitive. I think a 10 or 15 minute return policy for the market in general is a fantastic idea. Contracts can stay as is though.
/signed |
Lt George
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Posted - 2009.05.29 11:30:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Tom Peeping
A. Scamming doesn't remain a problem. Working as intended. That is the only constructive criticism and you've gotten it lots of times.
Constructive criticism doesn't not mean that we have to agree with you, or in some way "constructively" modify your suggestion. There has to be a simple I disagree option available. That doesn't count as flaming or being stupid.
I admit I had not realized scamming is a legal game mechanic, but even so it doesn't mean that it isn't open to criticism.
I agree, 'constructive' is not synonymous with 'agree', though it is a means to a better outcome. Simply calling someone a 'piece of fruit' (rotten or no) or telling them to 'stop crying' is pointless and childish, the scribbles of a fool.
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Lt George
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Posted - 2009.05.29 11:31:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Jade Mitch Edited by: Jade Mitch on 28/05/2009 20:21:52
Most of the people who get scammed are old and blind, or near blind, and they don't always catch ever detail especially when Eve's market interface is so visually confusing and unintuitive. I think a 10 or 15 minute return policy for the market in general is a fantastic idea. Contracts can stay as is though.
/signed
Thank you! That's exactly what I had in mind
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Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2009.05.29 11:57:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Jarvis Hellstrom The reason I feel that CCP may be going the wrong way in allowing scamming is that, honestly, if someone gets taken badly enough and early enough that's a lost account, a lost customer and a bunch of other potential customers that may never play EVE. In short, it's bad business.
It's just as easy to argue that EVE's nasty nature lures in and retains customers. Customers who would quit/not join if EVE was dumbed down in favor of protecting the stupid. I don't actively scam myself but I would consider it a big loss to EVE's atmosphere if it was no longer possible.
Originally by: Signature Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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