Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2009.04.15 16:05:00 -
[1]
http://www.eveonline.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?patchlogID=186
- New wireframe graphic for probe widgets that is less bright and more distinct.
- New scanning effects.
- ID column on scan results shows specific ID of every target site. This applies to hidden cosmic sites as well as ships, drones, structures, etc.
- A target ID scanned to 100% will stay 100% in future scans (this does not apply to SHIPS). This may include multiple scan targets.
- You can ignore specific IDs or "ignore other results." Right-click on a scan result to activate these 2 choices. Once anything is ignored, the filter menu includes an option to show all ignored IDs. It also allows you to un-ignore specific IDs in a 2nd drop-down menu. This gives the explorer considerable new power.
- You can remotely bookmark 100% "warpable" targets (i.e. without going there).
Yes, this makes the process of managing a lot of targets much, much easier.
That's what I've seen on test. Will update with anything else we pull out of notes or experience. Last I checked, there was at least 1 bug with split scan results but I haven't checked today's release candidate on the test server.
----------------------------- (suggestion)
I'd like to repeat my own suggested change to this system:
Require hitting 75% before you can use the IgnoreID options on the applicable IDs. Then make this requirement decrease 10% per Pinpointing skill rank down from 75% - and give DSProbes their own 25% reduction bonus which then makes Astro 5 very valuable).
That means somebody with Pinpointing 5 would have only a 25% requirement for the IgnoreID features, and if they use DSProbes (Astro 5) then it's down to 0% - they could ignore any/all IDs on first scan. This makes the IgnoreID feature driven by training level.
___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 09:17:00 -
[2]
You've already made the topic so I will add this here...
Quote: Abnormalities between scan strength curve vs. scan range have now been fixed. Dropping a scanner probe to a lower scan range will no longer degrade your signal result. For example, if you are 3.9 au from a ship and drop a 8 AU probe and scan, then drop a 4 AU probe and repeat the scan, the result of the 4 AU scan will always be greater or equal to that of the 8AU scan.
I swear this is the reason some signatures have been impossible to track down. Noticeable when thereÆs more than about 4 sigs in close proximity. IÆve noticed what seemed like some pretty wild, and plain wrong, scan deviations which have led to previously scanned results no matter how careful IÆve been.
Quote: It is now possible to bookmark a 100% signature hit remotely via right click in the context menu. In addition, the scanner will remember signatures which were scanned at 100% so that they are not lost on subsequent scans.
This might be making things a little too easy, but it makes perfect sense. ThereÆs times IÆve been waiting patiently to get on with another scan because I canÆt warp my cov ops in and bm a previous site. For w-space where you absolutely donÆt want to lose your prober this is feature #1 of the patch.
Quote: Every scan result will now get a unique ID allowing you to manage and sort scan results with greater ease. You can now filter this unique ID and ignore all other results when scanning for certain signatures.
Ship probing boost! And generally makes scanning easier, although it dumbs the process down a bit too much for my liking.
Quote: Switching to the directional scanner window while a probe scan is in progress will no longer result in no legitimate results from being displayed.
The fact it was doing this didnÆt occur to me, possibly missed so many plexes as a result, assuming it was every time you do this. At least itÆs been fixed.
Quote: Sorting probes by ID number will now correctly list them from 1-10 or 10-1 depending on setting.
Naming or colour coding them would be more intuitive but any fix is good.
Quote: Using the right click option along with ctrl or shift on multiple probes now works properly. Previously this would only allow you to take action on one probe instead of multiple probes.
I was getting by with ctrl+shift+right click but again, a fix is a fix. Anything to make scanning less of a CTS inducing click nÆ drag fest is appreciated.
Quote: Any probes that are active but do not expire during a scan process will become stuck in a moving state and cannot be interacted with until they expire. Newly launched probes can now be used to scan correctly without displaying a warning notice that active probes are still in use.
Wormholes will always appear correctly when scanned down. Previously there were some instances where the wormhole graphic would not appear.
Tech III: The fourth electronic subsystem will provide bonus to equip an expanded probe launcher and gain a 10% scan strength bonus to probes per level
# The "Show Hint" option will now appear correctly for the scanner probe in the solar system map.
The directional scanner has once again has the option to right click on a scan result and add/remove to overview and show info.
The directional scanner will now display scan results correctly when sorted by name, type or distance.
The number of gas and ore sites in wormhole space has been reduced to remove unnecessary results in the scanner. The new system will have more concentrated gas and bigger asteroids in the remaining sites to compensate.
The Sisters Combat Scanner Probe I and blueprint I, Core Scanner Probe I and blueprint I and Deep Space Scanner Probe I and blueprint I have had the "I" removed to represent the proper faction variant....
|
Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 09:17:00 -
[3]
Quote: The tutorial for Exploration has been changed to include more up to date and useful information regarding scanning mechanics.
The scanner will no longer get stuck when trying to scan with an offline scan probe launcher.
An error will no longer be generated in the logserver when opening the scanner window.
A grammatical error has been corrected in the notify message displayed when attempting to reload probes into a launcher when no probes are available in the cargo hold.
Analyzing with probes of any kind (Combat, Core or Deep Space) will no longer generate an exception error.
Scan filters when probing for ships are now working as intended.
The "beep" which is generated when using a scanning device has now been fixed. The sound will no longer continue to play if you dock or jump out of the system before the scan has completed.
Also, while the new Red Dwarf mini series was rather disappointing, it appears to share sound effects with the scanning system in eve.
That is all.
|
Devlan Khain
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 11:51:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Quote:
The "beep" which is generated when using a scanning device has now been fixed. The sound will no longer continue to play if you dock or jump out of the system before the scan has completed.
Also, while the new Red Dwarf mini series was rather disappointing, it appears to share sound effects with the scanning system in eve.
That is all.
And here I was thinking I was the only person who noticed that. I was sitting watching Red Dwarf and was being driven mad trying to work out where I recognized that sound effect from.
|
La Gloria
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 14:53:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Ship probing boost! And generally makes scanning easier, although it dumbs the process down a bit too much for my liking.
I was thinking this too... But I'm sure I'll get over my tricks for doing it the old-hard way when it takes me a fraction of the time to scan down a system. All in all sounds good.
I'm just hopeing for a stealth-patch in the sig spawns in Wormholes with a POS.
|
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 17:11:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Nyota Sol on 16/04/2009 17:15:45
fyi - IDs seem to be client and session independent but not quite "universal." This means 2 players should get the same ID on a target but this gets tricky with combat scanning.
From earlier testing on Sisi server:
- Player1 in Ship1 in System1 seems to always have same ID.
- Player1 in Ship1 in System2 gets a different ID.
- Player1 in Ship2 in System1 gets a different ID.
In other words, the ID for the player/ship will change in a new system or with a different ship. The code seems to be derived by a combination of system, ship and pilot IDs. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 17:39:00 -
[7]
BUG:
Pre-existing filters may not work initially. Opening, editing and re-saving them will reset each filter.
BUG:
Probe widgets have shader effects and shadows making them extremely hard to utilize on some systems and settings. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Jonathan Calvert
Minmatar Empire Mining and Trade
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 18:15:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Nyota Sol BUG:
Pre-existing filters may not work initially. Opening, editing and re-saving them will reset each filter.
BUG:
Probe widgets have shader effects and shadows making them extremely hard to utilize on some systems and settings.
Yeah, I can barely see through the new probe bubbles to see my widgets.
|
Dixi Zi
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 18:56:00 -
[9]
1. New Probe bubbles - SUXXX!!!
Can't see anything inside.
2. Scanning visualisation - very annoying blinking. Remove it at all or let us switch it off, please.
3. Where is at last "Cosmic Anomaly" filter checkbox? Still have to switch to "show all" to see them.
|
Dixi Zi
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 19:21:00 -
[10]
Scanning looks bugged atm. When I get 3 probes on a signature should be two red dots. I see only one. When I drop two probes on a signature, and they do not connect, I should get two signals, clicking each should paint red sphere. When I do it, I see only one sphere. Other seems lost as well.
|
|
Dixi Zi
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 19:39:00 -
[11]
Do ppl who design and impement probe scanning have enough time to test what they create? I wish they have to scan with what they make like 3+ hours non stop, before changes goes live...
All those less transparent textures on probe bubbles, scanning animation... What the hell all that for? To make one's eyes hurt?
Simple spheres, like there were before Apocryptica, no scanning animation, PLUS correctly working filters and no bugs - thats what I'm dreaming about.
Dixi
PS From my point of view, pre-apocryptica scanning was much better, but I afraid that no one will roll it back...
|
Narfas Deteis
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 19:57:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Dixi Zi
PS From my point of view, pre-apocryptica scanning was much better, but I afraid that no one will roll it back...
Yea, there was "feeling" of exploration. Nice niche mini-profession. Not for everyone. Then CCP destroyed this profession, made it mainstream, dumbed it to hell and back and then dumbed it again. This is not exploration anymore. This is moving damn balls faster then all other people on local. Forget about knowledge, skills, patience, investments and feeling that you are doing something unique. Just move these widgets closer. Unbelievable, this is way more boring then clicking "scan" every 2 minutes like before Apocrypha.
|
Marlenus
Caldari Ironfleet Towing And Salvage Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 20:47:00 -
[13]
Folks who can't see their probe widgets inside multiple bubbles: I've discovered that it's intensely dependent on your graphics settings. I turned all of mine up to high, and the widgets are visible; but at lower settings (especially lower shader settings I think) they vanish.
I fear CCP forgot to keep the new content compatible with lower-end hardware, this time. ------------------ Ironfleet.com |
Dixi Zi
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 21:10:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Marlenus it's intensely dependent on your graphics settings. I turned all of mine up to high, and the widgets are visible; but at lower settings (especially lower shader settings I think) they vanish.
If I turn everything high it does not run smoothly 4 clients. Actually graphic FPS and occational lags become a problem since cancelation of Classic cilent support. It works so-so on all medium settings, but for 3 clients. Also classic client when minimized, behaved himself almost like closed appication - consumed no resources and didn't affected FPS on other windows. Can't say same about Premium clients now :-(
Originally by: Marlenus
I fear CCP forgot to keep the new content compatible with lower-end hardware, this time.
Umm ATi 4850 or nVidia GT 8800 already become low-end hardware? ;-)
|
Dixi Zi
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 21:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Narfas Deteis
Then CCP destroyed this profession, made it mainstream, dumbed it to hell and back and then dumbed it again. ... Forget about knowledge, skills, patience, investments and feeling that you are doing something unique. Just move these widgets closer.
Yes it's really disappointing. I wish they made exploration harder. I mean more complex. I still beleave that EVE is unique game because good strategic planning and understanding what you are doing leads to success in this game, not fast clicking or dumb repeatable actions (witch still preset). Yes, some actions in this game takes time, but if played in multi-account mode, as most ppl do, it's ok.
|
Marlenus
Caldari Ironfleet Towing And Salvage Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 21:49:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Dixi Zi Umm ATi 4850 or nVidia GT 8800 already become low-end hardware? ;-)
When you're trying to run four clients it is...
No, seriously, the reason I discovered that settings matter is that before the patch, I often had two or three clients going, and it was easier to leave all my settings low. Now I've pretty much got to turn them up on whichever client I'm using for scanning.
Frankly I don't expect CCP to create a client that will run four instances at high settings on average gaming hardware; two would be nice, but I'm perfectly willing to keep settings low in exchange for running multiple clients.
What I don't like is having functionality go away when I do that. Plus, I have some pity for folks who are running old laptops and such, who don't have the option of turning the settings all the way up.
And thus, my crack: it sounds like CCP forgot to make sure the new content was functional for folks who are stuck at less-than-high graphics settings. Not me, and not you, Mr. Four Clients. ;-) ------------------ Ironfleet.com |
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2009.04.16 22:08:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Nyota Sol on 16/04/2009 22:11:32
Spending hours scanning a site down was better?
There's a funny myth that thousands of WoW players came into Eve and trained CovertOps/Codebreaker in a few hours, then went out and stripped thousands of radar sites that nobody has previously found in highsec... flooding the markets with cheap goods in the days after apoc's release.
In the handful of cases i've seen prices drop on exploration goods, i noticed most of them were dropping before apoc or right at it's release. That indicates folks were dumping stockpiles as part of a run on the market, not due to some explosion in new supplies.
The only thing "ruined" about exploration seems to be the sense of being special... and the increased competition over LIMITED supplies of radar sites. Competition is good.
If you don't like it... move over. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Narfas Deteis
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 01:52:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Nyota Sol Edited by: Nyota Sol on 16/04/2009 22:11:32
Spending hours scanning a site down was better?
Sure, because that was nice time for speculations whats there (and also checking directional, checking market, chating, preparing better bookmarks and so on). Now that's just repetitive and brainless moving spheres closer and closer.
Originally by: Nyota Sol
There's a funny myth that thousands of WoW players came into Eve and trained CovertOps/Codebreaker in a few hours, then went out and stripped thousands of radar sites that nobody has previously found in highsec... flooding the markets with cheap goods in the days after apoc's release.
Well, I would say number of explorers increased after Apocrypha. Don't you agree with that?
Originally by: Nyota Sol
In the handful of cases i've seen prices drop on exploration goods, i noticed most of them were dropping before apoc or right at it's release. That indicates folks were dumping stockpiles as part of a run on the market, not due to some explosion in new supplies.
Prices od decryptors dropped by ~40% in 2-3 weeks after Apocrypha. Most sell orders that's 2-10 decryptors. It doesn't seem to be "stockpile".
Originally by: Nyota Sol
The only thing "ruined" about exploration seems to be the sense of being special... and the increased competition over LIMITED supplies of radar sites. Competition is good. If you don't like it... move over.
Sure. I enjoyed exploration, invested my time and ISKs to be good in this profession and then CCP dumbed exploration to hell, gave everything for free, and you call it "competition"? There's just no content for dedicated explorers. New exploration is extremely boring and repetitive. There's no challenge (except dealing with graphical mess and clunky interface). Exploration is now mainly about shooting things up because scanning is only formality. And if there are no skills nor personal abilities involved in exploration anymore there's no competition. Come on, there's more competition in mining veld.
Ah yes, and last thing: supplies of radar sites are NOT limited.
|
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 03:05:00 -
[19]
I was under the impression that there is a quota/cap on radar spawns for a given constellation or region, and that it wont automatically respawn a new one right away. I assume that folks pre-apoc were doing a fairly decent job clearing out Empire's spawns. Hence i question this idea there was some massive increase in supplies... from people who just suddenly decided to start training or doing exploration because it was so easy.
Did they change the rates of loot?
Originally by: Narfas Deteis
Originally by: Nyota Sol
In the handful of cases i've seen prices drop on exploration goods, i noticed most of them were dropping before apoc or right at it's release. That indicates folks were dumping stockpiles as part of a run on the market, not due to some explosion in new supplies.
Prices od decryptors dropped by ~40% in 2-3 weeks after Apocrypha. Most sell orders that's 2-10 decryptors. It doesn't seem to be "stockpile".
Look at 1 year market charts for every single decryptor.
Prices were decreasing 1-2 months prior to apoc (having shot up in nov 08). Demand also started going up after apoc. Mix various factors and people being irrational, and you get a natural additional decline.
In most cases, prices are about where they were a year ago, having peeked in november, while demand seems to be stronger than a year ago. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Qual
Gallente Cornexant Research
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 07:27:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Narfas Deteis
Sure. I enjoyed exploration, invested my time and ISKs to be good in this profession and then CCP dumbed exploration to hell, gave everything for free, and you call it "competition"? There's just no content for dedicated explorers. New exploration is extremely boring and repetitive. There's no challenge (except dealing with graphical mess and clunky interface).
Lol. Seriously. LOL.
The old system was not about skill or ability. its was about having enough time to sit around waiting for the result. ANY idiot could do it. Tell me where the skill and knowledge came into the old system!?! You dropped quest probes at planets, (we all know sites are within 4AU of a planet) scanned until a hit, drop probe there, scan until hit, repeat. No skill required, just time.
The new system at least require you to know just a bit about triangulation. I agree that the new 1.1 patch ID system makes it a bit too easy, but thats the only flaw I see in the new system. At least I have to be active at the screen while probing not just ding it semi afk pressing the scan button every few minutes.
It not flawless, but it requires abit more activity than the old system, which tbh I dont think is a bad thing.
"The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf |
|
Trisy A
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 07:49:00 -
[21]
About "activity of button pressing" in exploration. Yes, it was better before. Cheking results and pressing a button once a few minutes fit in EVE playstyle much more then moving bubbles non stop. When one drives a freighter, mine with a Hulk, even manage his sell/buy orders - all those activities are on same plan and time table: correct plan 1st, then you sit & press a few buttons once in a few minutes. Usually once in 2-3 minutes (exact time intervals depends ...).
From gameplay point of view correct probe placement was more challengeble then moving bubbles now.
And about profit. Exploration was not only for profit. Combat Deadspace complexes - that's the only ineresting and challengeble combat thing for PVE combat play.
|
ollobrains
Caldari State Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 08:08:00 -
[22]
please after the dsp nerf leave the id system as is once u have an id leave it.
Other option is randomise them but no 50% chance rubbish makes it a little easier. Both for probers pve types and pvpers seeking pve targets. U still need to whip out the cores and what not giving targets time to escape
|
Morscerta
Gallente Living in the Fridge
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 08:11:00 -
[23]
Ok back to topic and less this idiotic, it was way better in the past. And for the record I have used both systems extensively and prefer this one. However it still could be tweaked.
First Questions: - Do ignored IDs stay ignored just for the session or do they stay ignored (did not have time to test yesterday)? - Did it say in the patch notes that they are going to change names of the sites in WH-Space? - Did anybody notice a change in spawn triggers? - How are IDs for Grav, Ladar, etc. derived (to be specific if I ignore ID ASM-399 which happens to be a common perimeter grav site, do I ignore then all Grav sites or do I ignore just common perimeter grav sites?)
Facts: - The new bubbles make scanning with more than four probes even harder than before - The new ignore feature is great and I do not want any adjustments to it (except maybe make it only available at Astrometrics 5 so all the noob explorers can't use it ) - Bookmarking at 100% is marvelous and should have been implemented from the start - I also suffer from the price drop in decryptors but as they come for free and I have no cost aquiring them accept time value for money therefore I and probably all other "dedicated explorers" will not go bankrupt. (Especially when the occasional Vigilant BPC drops )
And to whine a little myself - Give me Strength 20 on my deep space back, I like to be done in WH-Space in 5 minutes. I think 15 min is just way too much
|
ollobrains
Caldari State Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 08:18:00 -
[24]
ID stay ignored only while in system if u log or jump thro wh they reset but u can bm sites remotley now so if u go back well u get the idea 0.25au and if its the sig u move on
spawn triggers have changed on a few sites
|
Qual
Gallente Cornexant Research
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 08:49:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Trisy A
About "activity of button pressing" in exploration. Yes, it was better before. Cheking results and pressing a button once a few minutes fit in EVE playstyle much more then moving bubbles non stop. When one drives a freighter, mine with a Hulk, even manage his sell/buy orders - all those activities are on same plan and time table: correct plan 1st, then you sit & press a few buttons once in a few minutes. Usually once in 2-3 minutes (exact time intervals depends ...).
Buy/seel does not fit here. As for mining and flying around, these things take time due to game balance issues.
Scanning do now have reduced time requirements (but certainly not zero time) which opens up the opputunity for CCP to move more content into exploration mode. (I would welcome a move to put belts in as exporation only.)
Originally by: Trisy A
From gameplay point of view correct probe placement was more challengeble then moving bubbles now.
How could you place it wrong? Sites are within 4 AU of a planet. Place the probe at planets. You couldn't mess it up in any way or form. (Ok, you could save a few isk by making optimal scan spots between planets, but that was more greed driven than need driven.) Now at least you have to think about how you set up your probes to catch the signal. Saying that the old system required any kind of player skill is rubbish. It did not!
"The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf |
Von Kapiche
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 09:29:00 -
[26]
Sensible additions ( well, the probe graphics makes my eyes water a little :P ). Now just tweak the strength of everything so training matters a little more & it'll be gold.
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 10:00:00 -
[27]
Back to FAQ editing....
|
Morscerta
Gallente Living in the Fridge
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 10:15:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Back to FAQ editing....
And probably will not be the last time...
|
Kambiri Zoltana
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 10:39:00 -
[29]
I kinda like the new system, only getting some lagg spikes when zoooming up close on the probes which I hadn't experienced before. For the rest I like the new changes with the ID, the new spheres dont bother me that much.
|
Sarina Berghil
|
Posted - 2009.04.17 11:14:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Dixi Zi Scanning looks bugged atm. When I get 3 probes on a signature should be two red dots. I see only one. When I drop two probes on a signature, and they do not connect, I should get two signals, clicking each should paint red sphere. When I do it, I see only one sphere. Other seems lost as well.
I can confirm this bug. When one signature gives 2 results in the list, only one of them will ever show up in the system map. The best workaround atm seems to be to turn off a probe to get a circle instead.
Also for me it is very hard to see or move the probes around with the new effects. Although they do look pretty.
The feature to filter results is almost necessary to make scanning work in environments with a lot of results. But I do agree that it makes it a bit too easy mode sometimes. The suggestion to only allow filtering and only give IDs on signatures that have been scanned to a certain percentage makes sense, both from a gameplay perspective and a 'tech' perspective. After all the system would need enough information about a signature to be able to identify it during subsequent scans.
Also having IDs that are unique between characters and ships would be useful to make it easier to coordinate with other players scanning. If the IDs are hidden until a certain percentage is reached, it would still be somewhat limited.
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |