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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:09:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 11/03/2009 11:15:45 Edited by: Space Wanderer on 11/03/2009 11:10:02 Will be updated the more questions I can see.
1) What of the new probes I need?
Currently, you might want core probes and deep space probes. Using only core probes is also viable, although a bit harder. If you use only core probes you can just fit a core launcher (only 15 CPU), otherwise you need an expanded one (220 CPU).
2) I am in a new system, how am I supposed to multispec it?
Shortly, there are no multispectral probes in the new system. However you can use deep space probes at higher range to know how many sites are in the system, and their signal strength (please refer to this thread to know what is what). If you can't use deep space you can still drop some core at 32AU or some combat probes at 64AU. Also, if you get a signal strength higher than 25% on a site you will be told its type, so a deep space probe with range 8AU will report the type of most sites inside its range.
3) What type is a wormhole?
Unknown.
4) I get a signal with 100% strength but can't warp to it
You need four probes hitting the site, to get a warpable hit.
5) I am getting four signals at 100% from my four probes for the same site, but can't warp to any of them.
Signal strength is only ONE of the variables affecting scanning. Probes shouldn't be too clustered, or only on one side of the site, otherwise probes won't be able to combine their hits into a single warpable hit. Please see this thread for more information about signal strength and probe placements.
6) I can't get 100% signal strength on a site.
Depending on your skills, equipment, ships, implants, the signal strength may vary A LOT. If, with a single probe, you are not able to obtain at least a 50% signal strength no matter how close to the site it is, you WILL NOT be able to find that site with that equipment. Refer to this thread for information about the signal strength.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:16:00 -
[2]
Reserved
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Aniel Zaar
Gallente Light of Orion
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:22:00 -
[3]
Good combination of the facts anyone who probes should know.
Haven't had a chance to try Deep space probes, using 8 core @ 32 gives god preliminary results.
*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones. |
Thenoran
Caldari Tranquility Industries
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:26:00 -
[4]
Here's how to scan down a sig
Get the four probes to each intersect each other at the sig, I've had no problems nailing down sites this way. ------------------------ Low-sec is like sailing along the coast of Somalia...
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Echo Vector
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:29:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Thenoran Here's how to scan down a sig
.....................
Get the four probes to each intersect each other at the sig, I've had no problems nailing down sites this way.
That is fine until you are off on the Z axis.
Use 6 probes ftw.
Don't be like Khan. Think in 3 dimensions.
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Aniel Zaar
Gallente Light of Orion
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:33:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Thenoran Here's how to scan down a sig
Get the four probes to each intersect each other at the sig, I've had no problems nailing down sites this way.
Another way to do it is using a pyramid - gives you a bit more area coverage.
Originally by: Echo Vector That is fine until you are off on the Z axis.
Use 6 probes ftw.
Don't be like Khan. Think in 3 dimensions.
4 probes the minimum amount to use and is faster then using more probes when pinpointing one site. Only makes sense to use more then 4 when you have 2, 3, 4 sites near each other but covered by one set of 4 probes. *-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones. |
Delnas Sapphire
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:35:00 -
[7]
Is high sec exploration profitable What are the combat non combat exploration sites and what do they produce What can you expect getting into exploration
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Aniel Zaar
Gallente Light of Orion
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Posted - 2009.03.11 11:46:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Delnas Sapphire Is high sec exploration profitable
Not as profitable as other high sec ventures, ie lvl4 mission running.
Originally by: Delnas Sapphire What are the combat non combat exploration sites and what do they produce
All exploration sites have NPCs guarding them, with a few exceptions in gas clouds (Ladar) and asteroid belts (Gravimetric).
Originally by: Delnas Sapphire What can you expect getting into exploration
Competition. *-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones. |
Jonathan Calvert
Minmatar Empire Mining and Trade
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Posted - 2009.03.11 12:15:00 -
[9]
How about updating the evlopedia entry with this info?
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Exploration
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 12:16:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 11/03/2009 12:17:15
Originally by: Jonathan Calvert How about updating the evlopedia entry with this info?
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Exploration
If you see, on the head of the page there is a link to these infos:
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Exploration:_Apocrypha
The pages should be inverted, though. Now the old scan system is obsolete.
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Jonathan Calvert
Minmatar Empire Mining and Trade
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Posted - 2009.03.11 12:22:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Jonathan Calvert on 11/03/2009 12:22:41
Originally by: Space Wanderer Edited by: Space Wanderer on 11/03/2009 12:17:15
Originally by: Jonathan Calvert How about updating the evlopedia entry with this info?
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Exploration
If you see, on the head of the page there is a link to these infos:
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Exploration:_Apocrypha
The pages should be inverted, though. Now the old scan system is obsolete.
Hmm, yeah, looks like there is a explo apoc page for developement, the the old one, which I removed the old info. Perhaps on "explo" page, there should just be a link to the Explo APoc page for a history of the developement and testing. I have this feeling youre sitting on the explo channel right now watching these questions asked over and over :)
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Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows
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Posted - 2009.03.11 12:29:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Space Wanderer 10) I got a 100% warpable hit, I warped to it, and nothing was where. What gives?
It's a bug, should be fixed in next patch. Workaround: rescan with the same probes in the same position, and rewarp.
Not to go deeply into this, but this is also caused by using probes of different ranges simultaniously. If you make sure all probes are of the same range you will have less problems with this .
Regards,
M.M.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 13:19:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Jonathan Calvert I have this feeling youre sitting on the explo channel right now watching these questions asked over and over :)
Eh, not right now, but yes. I contacted the explo chan mods asking them to change the MOTD, pointing it to the apoc page. Can't do more than that.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 13:20:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Miss Moonwych Not to go deeply into this, but this is also caused by using probes of different ranges simultaniously. If you make sure all probes are of the same range you will have less problems with this .
That's interesting. You got more data about this you want to post in the other thread?
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Aton Ptha
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Posted - 2009.03.11 13:56:00 -
[15]
Please make this a Sticky.
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Espoir
Trans-Solar Works FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2009.03.11 15:10:00 -
[16]
I made a video tutorial (maybe there are better ones out there). Links to ressources are there, too
LINK
Nice FAQ btw
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Confuzer I
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Posted - 2009.03.11 16:24:00 -
[17]
Logic dictates that with 3 probes, and 2 points, I should be able to choose each point and warp to it.
Why not? I will be prob faster then scanning again...
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Ace Secunda
Dragon's Rage Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.03.11 16:27:00 -
[18]
Because there is nothing in that area physically for your warpdrive to lock onto and warp too maybe?
'If I can't blow it up It don't exsist'
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 16:33:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Confuzer I Logic dictates that with 3 probes, and 2 points, I should be able to choose each point and warp to it.
Why not?
Because each fo those points won't have a sig str larger than 50%.
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Imiarr Timshae
Caldari Funny Men In Funny Hats
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Posted - 2009.03.11 16:50:00 -
[20]
Its worth mentioning that wormholes can Gimp/Pimp your stuff.
You can have gimped cap recharge and lock range.
The only confirmed pimpage from a wormhole system is currently +50% ship velocity.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 16:59:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Imiarr Timshae The only confirmed pimpage from a wormhole system is currently +50% ship velocity.
Eh? There is a lot confirmed pimpage. I recall only shield increase, but that's me not paying attention.
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Imiarr Timshae
Caldari Funny Men In Funny Hats
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Posted - 2009.03.11 17:00:00 -
[22]
Well, why not list it then?
I stated only confirmed as from me, as I am currently in a +50% velocity wormhole. I thought if you knew of more you would state them.
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Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows
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Posted - 2009.03.11 18:56:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 11/03/2009 18:56:49
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Miss Moonwych Not to go deeply into this, but this is also caused by using probes of different ranges simultaniously. If you make sure all probes are of the same range you will have less problems with this .
That's interesting. You got more data about this you want to post in the other thread?
It certainly is interesting. I don't have much hard data (as in numbers because deviation is kinda random). But it seems deviation is not calculated using the average target strength of all probes (which is >= 100%) but by averaging the deviation of each probe which in turn is based on the target strength of these individual probes. Its quite subtle but I think this is causing the bug. I suspect they will change this soon so it won't be an issue anymore.
Anyway I thought it would be a good idea to explain what can (also) cause these warp-to-nothing situations and how to avoid them.
Regards,
M.M.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.11 18:59:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Miss Moonwych by averaging the deviation of each probe which in turn is based on the target strength of these individual probes.
Well, if deviation is based on target strength of invisdual probes that would explain the bug very well, since you can get 100% strength when the individual probes have only 50% strength individually.
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Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows
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Posted - 2009.03.11 19:13:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Miss Moonwych by averaging the deviation of each probe which in turn is based on the target strength of these individual probes.
Well, if deviation is based on target strength of invisdual probes that would explain the bug very well, since you can get 100% strength when the individual probes have only 50% strength individually.
True. But I think that only if a probe has less than its required 50% you will get deviation even if your average strength of all the probes is > 100%. Not entirely sure about that but lets just say that the magnitude of this problem has been demonstrated to the devs...
Regards,
M.M.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.12 09:22:00 -
[26]
Shameless bump.
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DrugsDen
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Posted - 2009.03.12 12:00:00 -
[27]
Very usefull post thank you
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Fish Bulb
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:00:00 -
[28]
I'm lost on one aspect of the initial scan.
If I have 7 Core Probes at 32au covering the entire system including a little bit if Z axis, minimal overlap, if there is something in my scan range, will I get SOME sort of hit everytime if something is there (like multispecs would) or is it chance based like the other old probes and I need to keep rescanning in order to get a hit NOT KNOWING IF THERE IS ANYTHING AT ALL TO FIND?
I need a primer on the initial system scan scan.
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Ace Secunda
Dragon's Rage Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:36:00 -
[29]
Yes, It will show if there is something there. But you will probably get sub 1.0% str hits on the sites. Then if you click on each one of the sites it will show a faint red sphere inside the range of the probe that got the hit, sometimes this sphere is so small from a good hit you can reduce that probe down to 8 or 4AU straight away..... I'm getting carried away now, go figure the rest out yerself
'If I can't blow it up It don't exsist'
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Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:43:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Ace Secunda Because there is nothing in that area physically for your warpdrive to lock onto and warp too maybe?
because a bookmark in empty space has something for you warp drive to lock on to ... --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
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Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows
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Posted - 2009.03.12 18:33:00 -
[31]
Just in case this question pops up again (and i'm sure it will): Eve doesn't use triangulation but trilateration. There is quite a big difference: measuring angles vs. distances.
So a probe can only measure its distance from a target right now.
Regards,
M.M.
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Armakoir
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Posted - 2009.03.13 07:05:00 -
[32]
Suggested question and change from the old system:
Can probes be positioned within the scan area of my other probes? Yes.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.13 09:28:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 13/03/2009 09:34:07
Originally by: Armakoir Suggested question and change from the old system:
Can probes be positioned within the scan area of my other probes? Yes.
Good question. Added. Now we need another one though, I don't feel comfortable in leaving 17 questions. :-)
EDIT: no matter, found another question in a different thread.
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Sillas Cov
Caldari 22nd Black Rise Defensive Unit
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Posted - 2009.03.13 16:29:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Sillas Cov on 13/03/2009 16:30:00 Okay lets get a few more clues translated into Scan strategies:
I get a Red sphere on a low % hit. How best do I place the cluster of core probes within, or around that sphere's volume?
Right now I just attempt to fill the volume of the hit with the scan volumes of my probes which seems to work okay.
Any ideas here?
Next I get a red ring within the volumes of my probe spheres as a result. Now, how should one use this feedback??
Sillas
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Tomogara
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Posted - 2009.03.13 20:59:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Echo Vector
That is fine until you are off on the Z axis.
Use 6 probes ftw.
Don't be like Khan. Think in 3 dimensions.
The best way is to use four probes in 3 dimensions -- making a four-pointed pyramid (tetrahedron) with the probes. No more than four probes will ever be evaluated for a given site, and with 109¦ central angles, a tetrahedron spaces the four probes maximally apart in the angular sense. This means that even with deviation, you're less likely to take a scan strength hit because of geometry.
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Espoir
Trans-Solar Works FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2009.03.14 16:53:00 -
[36]
Thanks for the FAQ - hope you will update it :)
I added it to a resource thread - hope this is ok :)
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.14 23:08:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Space Wanderer on 14/03/2009 23:08:54 Edited by: Space Wanderer on 14/03/2009 23:08:20
Originally by: Espoir Thanks for the FAQ - hope you will update it :)
As much as possible (should have reserved more than two posts )
Originally by: Espoir I added it to a resource thread - hope this is ok :)
No prob of course. You might want also to add the thread with the scan strength formula to it.
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Aniel Zaar
Gallente Light of Orion
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Posted - 2009.03.14 23:10:00 -
[38]
Please consider adding a few tips I shared in this thread to your guide. *-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^*-*^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones. |
Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.15 18:17:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Aniel Zaar Please consider adding a few tips I shared in this thread to your guide.
Yes, I had a look at it, but I had some difficulties extracting something that could be condensed into one or two newbie questions, with two-sentences replys.
If you can extract some FAQs from it and post them here I'll gladly put them here.
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Mr Xanatos
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Posted - 2009.03.15 23:39:00 -
[40]
Spent the last few days in W-Space with a few friends to see what it was like. Biggest problem is that there seems to be 50+ Sigs in them and all grouped in bunches.
How do you tell the Wormhole from the Sigs with out scanning every Sig down and bookmarking? Seems like a needle in a haystack situation.
Do Deep Space Scanner Probes help in narrowing things down? I don't want to train Astro 5 if its of little use.
Thanks |
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Minerva IV
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.03.15 23:50:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
Originally by: Ace Secunda Because there is nothing in that area physically for your warpdrive to lock onto and warp too maybe?
because a bookmark in empty space has something for you warp drive to lock on to ...
Well actually it could be argued that as someone has to have been to the point to bookmark it they have droped a becon to warp to. Make sence to explain tradable bm's too your given the frequancy to the becon to warp to.
If we could just warp to empty space we would be able to click on the map and warp to location :)
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Maddus Maximuss
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Posted - 2009.03.16 00:26:00 -
[42]
Are there any scannable sites NOT within 4AU of a planet? If so and you use deep space probes - how the hell does that work? thats one bloody big sphere to show up a hit on 1 if it up to 100AU out...
If not - what the hell is the point of deep space probes anyway? I finally trained Astrometrics V to be able to use them and have never once got a hit anywhere other than near a planet. For soem reason I thougth Ladar sites could be...
Someone please help. I posted with a similar question somewhere else but can't find the thread :S
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.16 11:35:00 -
[43]
- Sites beyond 4AU: Err... reading the FAQ in the OP, maybe?
- What's the point of deep space probes: added question 20.
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Wusti
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2009.03.17 00:25:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Wusti on 17/03/2009 00:25:38 eek - worng thread. _______________________
Welcome to The New Era
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.17 10:10:00 -
[45]
What are the different types of anomalies in W-space and how difficult are they?
Here's what i know so far. Id like confirmation on how the 4 types of anomalies per category may break down into specific tiers (i.e. do Core Strongholds tie specifically to tier 5?).
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) - checkpoint - hangar - camp - ambush point
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) - command - barracks - outpost - fortification
Core (tiers 5 & 6?) - garrison - stronghold - bastion - citadel
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.17 10:38:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Nyota Sol What are the different types of anomalies in W-space and how difficult are they?
[snip]
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) - checkpoint - hangar - camp - ambush point
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) - command - barracks - outpost - fortification
Core (tiers 5 & 6?) - garrison - stronghold - bastion - citadel
Good information. Might need more verification though. For instance I am pretty sure it does not work for sites. I found core gravitational sites in upper tiers (normal unknowns, no dangeour nor deadly).
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Kerien Shien
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:34:00 -
[47]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwBqnXruZuo
That gives a pretty good idea what your after when scanning.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.17 12:07:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Nyota Sol What are the different types of anomalies in W-space and how difficult are they?
[snip]
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) - checkpoint - hangar - camp - ambush point
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) - command - barracks - outpost - fortification
Core (tiers 5 & 6?) - garrison - stronghold - bastion - citadel
Good information. Might need more verification though. For instance I am pretty sure it does not work for sites. I found core gravitational sites in upper tiers (normal unknowns, no dangeour nor deadly).
I'd like to see it verified. I'm focusing on just anomalies because they can be scanned down instantly.
There are 4 types of perimeter anomalies, but they seem to come in pairs. Camp & Ambush Points vs Check Point & Hangars. I'm assuming one pairing is easier and thus Tier 1 vs Tier 2.
I cant test very well because i have a simple cruiser and get destroyed almost instantly.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.17 12:10:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Nyota Sol There are 4 types of perimeter anomalies, but they seem to come in pairs. Camp & Ambush Points vs Check Point & Hangars. I'm assuming one pairing is easier and thus Tier 1 vs Tier 2.
I cant test very well because i have a simple cruiser and get destroyed almost instantly.
Interesting point. Next times I'll go in wspace i'll keep an eye on it.
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Salvo Brunel
Clown Punchers Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.03.17 17:18:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Salvo Brunel on 17/03/2009 17:18:03 Can sites be found outside of the solar system boundary? In other words, if my 32au probe takes in all stargates, celestials etc is there any chance that I'm missing a site? My experience is that once I've scanned the part of the solar system with celestials in, I never find sites by moving my probes elsewhere. Could anyone confirm this, please?
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.17 23:07:00 -
[51]
FaQuestion: What are the different types of bonuses that you get when in a wormhole system?
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.18 00:37:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Nyota Sol FaQuestion: What are the different types of bonuses that you get when in a wormhole system?
Wish I knew... Probably somebody somewhere compiled a list, but I don't where.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.18 08:36:00 -
[53]
you'd think SOMEBODY would have done that by now and it's not the kind of information that you'd want to keep private.
Originally by: Salvo Brunel Edited by: Salvo Brunel on 17/03/2009 17:18:03 Can sites be found outside of the solar system boundary? In other words, if my 32au probe takes in all stargates, celestials etc is there any chance that I'm missing a site? My experience is that once I've scanned the part of the solar system with celestials in, I never find sites by moving my probes elsewhere. Could anyone confirm this, please?
I think almost all of them will be within 6au of planets, but i am not 100% sure about that.
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
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Posted - 2009.03.18 11:24:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Nyota Sol FaQuestion: What are the different types of bonuses that you get when in a wormhole system?
Wish I knew... Probably somebody somewhere compiled a list, but I don't where.
♥ Send isk if this helps you ♥
| Pulsar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-----------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Shield | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Armor Resists | -10% | -18% | -22% | -27% | -34% | -50% | | Cap recharge | -10% | +44% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Targeting range | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Signature | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Black Hole | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |---------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Missile velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Ship velocity | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Drone control range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Inertia | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Lock Range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Falloff | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
| Cataclysmic Variable | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |------------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Repair amount | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Shield transfer amount | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Shield repair | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Remote repair | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Capacitor capacity | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Capacitor recharge | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Magnetar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-----------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | ECM eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | TP eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Damp eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | TD eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | AOE Velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Drone Velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Targeting Range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Tracking Speed | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
| Red Giant | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Heat Damage | +10% | +18% | +22% | +27% | +34% | +50% | | Overload Bonus | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Smart Bomb Range | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Smart Bomb Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Wolf Rayet | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |---------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Armor Resist | +10% | +18% | +22% | +27% | +34% | +50% | | Shield Resist | -10% | -18% | -22% | -27% | -34% | -50% | | Small Weapon Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Signature Size | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
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Nyota Sol
|
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:08:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Nyota Sol FaQuestion: What are the different types of bonuses that you get when in a wormhole system?
Wish I knew... Probably somebody somewhere compiled a list, but I don't where.
| Pulsar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 |
Nice job!!
Just to confirm, the 6 Categories indicate tiers of w-space, right?
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:18:00 -
[56]
Yeah its their class. Class 1 being easiest tier.
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Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 09:36:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Lady Spank
♥ Send isk if this helps you ♥ [snip]
Hey, nice list. How confident are you in its completeness?
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 09:59:00 -
[58]
Unless they change something 99.99%
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Blue Dice
Gallente Aliastra
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 10:42:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Lady Spank
| Pulsar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-----------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Shield | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Armor Resists | -10% | -18% | -22% | -27% | -34% | -50% | | Cap recharge | -10% | +44% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Targeting range | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Signature | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
I suppose this is a little typo?
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 11:22:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Blue Dice I suppose this is a little typo?
a cookie for you
should be -19%
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Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 11:33:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Blue Dice I suppose this is a little typo?
a cookie for you
should be -19%
Could you edit your original post? I put a link on it in the FAQ and I prefer to have it updated.
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Sam'I'am
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 11:42:00 -
[62]
How do you tell which, if any, of these are in the system? Visually I ahve seen different ones but how to tell the strength and name?
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Nyota Sol FaQuestion: What are the different types of bonuses that you get when in a wormhole system?
Wish I knew... Probably somebody somewhere compiled a list, but I don't where.
♥ Send isk if this helps you ♥
| Pulsar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-----------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Shield | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Armor Resists | -10% | -18% | -22% | -27% | -34% | -50% | | Cap recharge | -10% | +44% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Targeting range | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Signature | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Black Hole | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |---------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Missile velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Ship velocity | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Drone control range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Inertia | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Lock Range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Falloff | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
| Cataclysmic Variable | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |------------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Repair amount | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Shield transfer amount | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Shield repair | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Remote repair | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Capacitor capacity | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Capacitor recharge | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Magnetar | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-----------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | ECM eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | TP eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Damp eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | TD eff. | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | AOE Velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Drone Velocity | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Targeting Range | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% | | Tracking Speed | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
| Red Giant | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |-------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Heat Damage | +10% | +18% | +22% | +27% | +34% | +50% | | Overload Bonus | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Smart Bomb Range | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Smart Bomb Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% |
| Wolf Rayet | C 1 | C 2 | C 3 | C 4 | C 5 | C 6 | |---------------------+------+------+------+------+------+-------| | Armor Resist | +10% | +18% | +22% | +27% | +34% | +50% | | Shield Resist | -10% | -18% | -22% | -27% | -34% | -50% | | Small Weapon Damage | +25% | +44% | +55% | +68% | +85% | +100% | | Signature Size | -10% | -19% | -27% | -34% | -41% | -50% |
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 11:58:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Space Wanderer Could you edit your original post? I put a link on it in the FAQ and I prefer to have it updated.
Edited and thanks.
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Lady Spank
Amarr Sekret Kool Klubb
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 12:09:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Sam'I'am How do you tell which, if any, of these are in the system? Visually I ahve seen different ones but how to tell the strength and name?
Compare the name of the wormhole with the following map, then check it on the chart posted.
http://011000110110111101100011011010110110110001100101.com/eve/whtcmap.png
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Nyota Sol
|
Posted - 2009.03.19 12:46:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Sam'I'am How do you tell which, if any, of these are in the system? Visually I ahve seen different ones but how to tell the strength and name?
Compare the name of the wormhole with the following map, then check it on the chart posted.
http://011000110110111101100011011010110110110001100101.com/eve/whtcmap.png
Link is messed up. Folks can copy/paste the text if they want.
Entity's map is incomplete it seems, and i was wondering if anybody knows if this will be updated with more WH names? And have we verified "repeat" classification of these WH names?
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Sam'I'am
|
Posted - 2009.03.20 10:44:00 -
[66]
err yeah but that just tells what class it is?....not what effects it gives.....oh carp,how does it say whether there is a Pulsar or Black hole in system?
so I'm in a N110....thats a green class 7 according to that map....but if I see some weird graphics in space: what are they (Pulsars or?)
Originally by: Lady Spank Edited by: Lady Spank on 19/03/2009 13:46:47
Originally by: Sam'I'am How do you tell which, if any, of these are in the system? Visually I ahve seen different ones but how to tell the strength and name?
Compare the name of the wormhole with the following map, then check it on the chart posted.
entity's wormhole map * fixed link, lack of sleep from probing all night (ooer).
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Nyota Sol
|
Posted - 2009.03.20 14:13:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Sam'I'am err yeah but that just tells what class it is?....not what effects it gives.....oh carp,how does it say whether there is a Pulsar or Black hole in system?
so I'm in a N110....thats a green class 7 according to that map....but if I see some weird graphics in space: what are they (Pulsars or?)
WH's will have classes not permanent ties to systems with specific effects.
WHs and w-systems are independent.
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Induc
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Posted - 2009.03.20 21:30:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Induc on 20/03/2009 21:30:24 Did I miss it or has someone already answered how to find out what type of system you're in? How do I know if the system is a pulsar, black hole, cataclysmic variable, magnetar, red giant or wolf rayet?
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Induc
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Posted - 2009.03.22 20:09:00 -
[69]
bump!
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Induc
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Posted - 2009.03.22 21:12:00 -
[70]
I kinda worked it out myself, I think it's like this: Not all wh systems has any of these effects, and you know if the system you entered has one by the "strange effects" popup when entering.
To find out which kind you got look at the skybox / background for any strange objects and then compare them to the phenomenons in this list.
And if you don't happen to know how for example an magnetar looks like, google it.
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Boydsan DeZinj
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Posted - 2009.03.23 00:31:00 -
[71]
I have had a few issues where I get a 100% signal and a yellow or green dot. But I can not warp to it. Any idea what is wrong? Bug? Likewise, I have also seen a open red circle at 100% and two red dots at 100% - also unwarpable. I have been thinking... could it be my low skills?
My current skills are
Astrometrics 3 Astrometrics Triangulation 3 Astrometrics Pinpointing 0 (since i need astrometrics to 4 to get it) Astrometric Acquisition 2
(I will be getting astrometrics to 4 soon... then go to 3 for both pinpointing and Acquisition)
I have also tried, all sorts of shapes to try to get a solid lock. Most of the time, I can get one without sweating But ever since this last patch. I get a few signals... I just can not lock down.. at all....
Sorry I posted this on the wrong thread... sorry...
One thing I like ot add... is....
Sometimes as I can it down... I will a stronger strength but it becomes a bubble or an open red circle. Then I have to repeat the process... but at a lower scan size.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.23 10:36:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Boydsan DeZinj Likewise, I have also seen a open red circle at 100% and two red dots at 100% - also unwarpable.
I have NEVER seen red dots at 100%. Most likely you are bumping into issues described in question 6).
Originally by: Boydsan DeZinj Sometimes as I can it down... I will a stronger strength but it becomes a bubble or an open red circle. Then I have to repeat the process... but at a lower scan size.
Question 6.
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PR0JECT 2501
Section Nine
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Posted - 2009.03.23 10:47:00 -
[73]
saw the post above about dif classes ( e.g pulsar, blackhole etc) of wormhole syst. how do you tell which one the system your in is?
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Nyota Sol
|
Posted - 2009.03.24 11:51:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Boydsan DeZinj I have had a few issues where I get a 100% signal and a yellow or green dot. But I can not warp to it. Any idea what is wrong? Bug? Likewise, I have also seen a open red circle at 100% and two red dots at 100% - also unwarpable. I have been thinking... could it be my low skills?
My current skills are
Astrometrics 3 Astrometrics Triangulation 3 Astrometrics Pinpointing 0 (since i need astrometrics to 4 to get it) Astrometric Acquisition 2
(I will be getting astrometrics to 4 soon... then go to 3 for both pinpointing and Acquisition)
I have also tried, all sorts of shapes to try to get a solid lock. Most of the time, I can get one without sweating But ever since this last patch. I get a few signals... I just can not lock down.. at all....
Sorry I posted this on the wrong thread... sorry...
One thing I like ot add... is....
Sometimes as I can it down... I will a stronger strength but it becomes a bubble or an open red circle. Then I have to repeat the process... but at a lower scan size.
In most cases, you can just fiddle with 4-5 probes and rescan. Sometimes you need to spread them out slightly.
I've had a handful of signatures that i could not scan above 70% no matter what i tried. I was using core probes and do not have max skills. However there are reports of highly skilled pilots having similar problems.
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Morscerta
Gallente Living in the Fridge
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Posted - 2009.03.24 12:15:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Nyota Sol What are the different types of anomalies in W-space and how difficult are they?
Here's what i know so far. Id like confirmation on how the 4 types of anomalies per category may break down into specific tiers (i.e. do Core Strongholds tie specifically to tier 5?).
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) - checkpoint - hangar - camp - ambush point
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) - command - barracks - outpost - fortification
Core (tiers 5 & 6?) - garrison - stronghold - bastion - citadel
I can confirm the lower tiers as I have not see many Tier 5 & 6 WH
I switched the order around starting with the easiest to the hardest from my experience (flying a passive drake)
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) Tier 1 - ambush point - camp Tier 2 - checkpoint - hangar
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) Tier 3 - outpost - fortification Tier 4 - barracks - command
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.24 13:23:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Nyota Sol What are the different types of anomalies in W-space and how difficult are they?
Here's what i know so far. Id like confirmation on how the 4 types of anomalies per category may break down into specific tiers (i.e. do Core Strongholds tie specifically to tier 5?).
Perimeter (tiers 1 & 2?) - checkpoint - hangar - camp - ambush point
Frontier (tiers 3 & 4?) - command - barracks - outpost - fortification
Core (tiers 5 & 6?) - garrison - stronghold - bastion - citadel
Can anybody verify these categories?
Can anybody differentiate the harder/easier tiers per "type" (i.e. which Core anomalies are Tier 6 vs Tier 7)?
Can anybody correlate these to the categories of WH description (i.e. unknown, dangerous unknown, etc)?
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Marlenus
Caldari Ironfleet Towing And Salvage Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.03.24 16:16:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Space Wanderer 18) Can sites spawn at more than 4AU from planets?
According to Greyscale they might, but reports are conflicting. The most believed theory is that common sites still spawn only at 4AU, while at least wormhole, or maybe all the new stuff, may spawn beyond that. No certain answer yet.
Just to contribute some data: In a week or so spent in one "unknown" w-space system, I've found wormholes out to about 6AU (5.9 max so far). I have yet to find any other type of site beyond the old 4AU limit, and I'm growing skeptical that they ever spawn deeper in space. If they do, it's on some sort of sharply diminishing probabilistic curve, and thus quite rare. ------------------ Ironfleet.com |
Marconi Bandr
|
Posted - 2009.03.24 23:17:00 -
[78]
I've been having trouble finding details on the mechanics of Radar/Ladar/Magnetometric sites. Such as what causes them to despawn, and how long does it take. This FAQ seems to be more on scanning and outposts than the actual exploration meta profession.
Specific question I had related to the following incident: I found an unusual site in low-sec which was Ladar, but no gas, it was a hacking site with 5 cans and a bunch or rats. I was impatient and tried ninja hacking one of the two cans that appeared to be the 'best' from the description and were far from the rats. I started taking damage after the first failed cycle, and left after about 3 failed cycles of the codebreaker. I warped back cloaked and the site was still there. I thought perhaps since I failed, it didnt' trigger a despawn. I warped out again, and came back 20 minutes later with help, but the site was now gone. So did someone else get it, or did I blow it by trying it without being properly prepared?
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Geldar Wroontik
Gallente Galactic System Lords Inc. Galactic System Lords Alliance
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:44:00 -
[79]
I'm pretty sure the trigger for a Radar or Magnetometric site to despawn is either to attempt or to successfully crack one of the cans. I've never tried warping away after cracking one of the cans so I can't tell you for certain (like hell I'm giving up a Radar site and its goodies ), but that's what I've heard.
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Marconi Bandr
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Posted - 2009.03.26 22:00:00 -
[80]
I agree you are probably correct. I was wondering how long after you leave it stays. I've 'cross warped' with an alt in and out of a site and it does not despawn. I'm just realizing I can probably answer my own question next time I'm online by leaving a finished site for increasing intervals. It seems unlikely to me that the despawn would vary by 'how' complete the site is.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.27 11:56:00 -
[81]
http://www.starvingpoet.net/?page=SpaceEffects
That site is really awesome.
Tracks the wormhole effects (more comprehensively than the above list) and adds screenshots of the different major phenomena (black hole, pulsar, etc).
___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.27 15:14:00 -
[82]
Class 1 (unknown): Perimeter Anomaly - camp - ambush point
Class 2 (unknown): Perimeter Anomaly - checkpoint - hangar
Class 3 (dangerous unknown): Frontier Anomaly - outpost - fortification
Class 4 (dangerous unknown): Frontier Anomaly - command - barracks
Class 5 (deadly unknown): Core Anomaly - garrison - stronghold
Class 6 (deadly unknown): Core Anomaly - bastion - citadel ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.03.27 15:24:00 -
[83]
Updated FAQ to reflect last patch effect on DSPs.
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Kva Plexcha
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Posted - 2009.03.28 01:00:00 -
[84]
Some questions ...
I have never used the tetrahedron formation when scanning, I have only used the planar cross ( I am assuming that this is when you have all 4 probes on the same plane and position them at 90 degree intervals around the dot.) To date I have been able to scan down any signature. Since this is effective, should I even bother to try the pyramid approach?
Is it possible to resize all of the selected (active) probes at the same time? I have been manually resizing each one as I narrow down on the signature.
I read a thread in these forums that asked if anyone had noticed a diminishing amount of signatures since the patch first came out. I have noticed this and am curious if it is by design?
Has the general location of plexes been changed? i.e. if I found a Angel 5/10 in a certain constellation - is it still findable in that constellation?
Somewhere someone posted that plexes immediately respawn upon completion, not after DT. Which is true?
Have the loot tables actually been changed? If so where does this information come from?
My apologies if I am asking things with obvious answers. Wanderer I appreciate the information you have collected - very informative.
BTW I have Astro 4, Covert 4, Pinpointing and Triangulation and Aqusition 3, 2 grav caps and Sisters Expanded Launcher w/ Sisters Core Probes
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.28 16:01:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Kva Plexcha Some questions ...
I have never used the tetrahedron formation when scanning, I have only used the planar cross ( I am assuming that this is when you have all 4 probes on the same plane and position them at 90 degree intervals around the dot.) To date I have been able to scan down any signature. Since this is effective, should I even bother to try the pyramid approach?
The tetrahedron is not required. I believe it's simply the most efficient setup because it uses 4 probes with wider angles.
If i understand the math behind the scan formulas, you get stronger results with 180 degree angles than you get from 90 degree angles. If you had 8 probes around a target, i think Eve would pick the 4 with the best angles and probably get something close to a tetrahedron if given enough probe choices.
But the mathematics of ideal positioning arent the same as the comfortable methods of finding or sorting signals.
Perhaps it could be argued that a diamond shape is ideal for seeking targets within a select area when dealing with deviation.
Originally by: Kva Plexcha
Is it possible to resize all of the selected (active) probes at the same time? I have been manually resizing each one as I narrow down on the signature.
In the scanner, shift-select all the probes and right click to change the range. You can also move them together by holding down shift while manipulating one.
___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Muzy
|
Posted - 2009.03.28 20:35:00 -
[86]
Sorry if these questions seem a bit newbieish but I thought I'd ask here anyway :)
Now I wanted to try out the new scanning system, my goal was to find a hacking site since I hear your can get some pretty nice stuff from these at times. I don't even have the hacking skill yet, but I just wanted to see if I could find one. Anyway, after a bit of scanning I've managed to get 2 locations, both of which were wormholes. I'm pretty new to the game so I didn't dare to even enter them. Plus, I've heard a few people way that you can't make it in there alone.
Can these hacking (and other) sites be found outside of wormholes?
How hard are the rats defending them? Could I with my 2m SP take them out?
Is there really a risk of being thrown deep into 0.0 space? (Rather not go there just yet)
How hard is it to get back where you came from?
Thanks :)
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.28 21:18:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Nyota Sol If i understand the math behind the scan formulas, you get stronger results with 180 degree angles than you get from 90 degree angles.
Not exactly. 90 degrees is exactly the same as as 180. And the "cross" formation theoretically is as effective as the tetrahedron. The snag here is "theoretically". With a cross formation a very small mistake in positioning the probes means that some angle becomes lower than 90 degrees, thus reducing the effectiveness of the formation. And considering deviation you willmost likely make mistakes in positioning. Contrarywise, the tetrahedron having the wider angles is more resistent to placement mistakes. Also it takes into account 3D issues, which the cross tend to ignore.
Having said that, in most common situations you don't need that degree of perfection. When I am not in "hardcore" mode, I usually resort to the cross, just because it's easier to move around than the tetrahedron. When things get hairy though (as after the DSP nerf), I resort to more complex configurations.
Originally by: Nyota Sol If you had 8 probes around a target, i think Eve would pick the 4 with the best angles
Usually. Not always.
Originally by: Nyota Sol Do what works for you, but appreciate the math underneath it.
I fully endorse both parts of this statement.
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2009.03.28 21:53:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Muzy Can these hacking (and other) sites be found outside of wormholes?
Yes. They contain different stuff though, mainly for T2 invention, instead of T3 reverse engineering.
Originally by: Muzy How hard are the rats defending them? Could I with my 2m SP take them out?
The sites outside the wh in highsec and lowsec are probably solable by any character with decent allocation of skillpoints. Inside wh I wouldn't suggest a green player to go solo. Not much for the amount of skillpoints, but for the reason that most likely you don't know HOW to use those skill points.
Originally by: Muzy Is there really a risk of being thrown deep into 0.0 space?
Yes.
Originally by: Muzy How hard is it to get back where you came from?
Coming back from a wh can be incredibly easy if the wh you came from did not collapse, a bit harder if the wh collapsed but you know how to probe your way through, and an ordaly if you are not good at probing, or just don't like it. Impossible if for any reason you lose your probes.
Coming back from 0.0 depends strictly on the ship you are using and its fitting. Anything larger than a cruiser won't see highsec again, most likely. Even ill-fitted cruisers won't make it back. Moreover, if you don't know 0.0, every ship can be considered lost, no matter what.
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Morscerta
Gallente Living in the Fridge
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Posted - 2009.03.31 08:53:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Geldar Wroontik I'm pretty sure the trigger for a Radar or Magnetometric site to despawn is either to attempt or to successfully crack one of the cans. I've never tried warping away after cracking one of the cans so I can't tell you for certain (like hell I'm giving up a Radar site and its goodies ), but that's what I've heard.
I can confirm this, as I had to warp away from a site after hacking a can, because I triggered the next spawn to early. I came back and just had the wrecks floating around.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.04.01 02:51:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Nyota Sol If i understand the math behind the scan formulas, you get stronger results with 180 degree angles than you get from 90 degree angles.
Not exactly. 90 degrees is exactly the same as as 180. And the "cross" formation theoretically is as effective as the tetrahedron.
You sure about that?
When i tested with 2 probes, I got smaller red circle results when i was closer to 180 than at 90 or 45. When aligned exactly at 180 the circle would be nearly impossible to see. Perhaps that's indicating something besides raw signal strength, but it certainly is related. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
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